EFR 895: Somatic Therapy, Trauma Release and Nervous System Regulation with Dr. Christian Gonzalez

00:00 - Chase (Host) The following is an Operation Podcast production. Do you think people nowadays are truly acting out of a direct response to real trauma, or has it just become another wellness trend?

00:12 - Christian (Guest) Everyone is tired of looking at the next person and saying you're traumatized and here's how and here's why, and I have a program for you. It's just a little tiring. Trauma is really the event. The PTSD is how people relate to the event. The long lasting effect is the compensatory, relational aspect to the trauma that people are expressing well into their teens and adult life, and that's what we're dealing with People who've created an identity that no longer serves them or causing issues in their relationships which they are looking to ascend past.

00:47 - Chase (Host) So how do we even begin to get on the path of healing if we don't know what the origin?

00:52 - Christian (Guest) is you break that exact thinking, because that's the thinking that keeps you in your head. And if someone's chronically sick and they're doing all of the supplements and the diet and they've seen all the doctors and the biohacks and they spent all the money and and they're still not getting better, I promise you it's in the nervous system. And if it's in the nervous system it can be overcome. And if it can be overcome, that's when you start seeing miracles change and I've seen it with my own eyes. And it's because the body remembers. The body remembers everything and if you don't express it, it needs to go somewhere. My name is Dr Christian Gonzalez, naturopathic doctor who specializes in somatic nervous system regulation, and I am excited to be here on Ever Forward Radio.

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03:13 Dr G man, welcome back to the show. Oh, thank you, we're here. We're here, baby, we're here. We're starting. I love it, yeah, and what you've been doing lately in health care and wellness and holistic medicine. You know I kind of have my own perspective from just you know, knowing you being local here in LA and also just watching your stuff online and with your podcast, um, but I'm curious to get your take on this shift in your world and the world, uh, and addressing trauma through the lens of like necessary healthcare modality. So with that I just want to kind of preface. I found this great definition from the American Psychological Association Bear with me, it's a little wordy here Quote any disturbing experience that results in significant fear, helplessness, dissociation, confusion or other disruptive feelings intense enough to have a long lasting negative effect on a person's attitudes, behavior and other aspects of functioning. So my first question is do you think people nowadays are truly acting out of with this definition in mind, out of a direct response to real trauma, or has it just become another wellness trend?

04:23 - Christian (Guest) Oh, that's a great opening question, man. We were talking about the wellness trend sort of facade behind it. When you look at, everyone is tired of looking at the next person and say you're traumatized and here's how and here's why, and I have a program for you. It's just a little tiring. I like that definition, but I would expand it even further to say that trauma is really the event.

04:50 The PTSD is how people relate to the event and I think that the long lasting effect is the compensatory, relational aspect to the trauma that people are expressing well into their teens and adult life. And that's what we're dealing with. It is people who've created an identity that no longer serves them or causing issues in their relationships which they are looking to ascend past. Now the problem is is that you can't ascend past your identity by talking about it. You kind of have to go back into the pain of what happened, not even necessarily identifying what happened, just going back to the pain and expressing the pain that wasn't expressed, so that the identity is now informed by a more expansive somatic experience. The identity is always a downstream expression of what's going inside of your body.

05:45 So for example if there is someone who went through a trauma where they were never able to express their true level of anger they did when they were a kid. You have a young kid, your kid's going to express all of these emotions.

06:00 And for the better part of seven years he will, and then at some point at the age of seven, his brainwaves are going to change and they're going to become more alpha dominant. He's in a meditative state. You're not going to remember anything that's happening right now unless he's tuned in and some weird savant and he's going to-.

06:16 - Chase (Host) Well, lucky for him, his dad records most of his life.

06:19 - Christian (Guest) So I got evidence. Bro, it's different. Bro, it's different. I get evidence Right when we were kids it was different.

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07:53 - Christian (Guest) So, dean, so for the better part of us, up till he's seven years old, he'll be in this theater brainwave state where he's just taking in the world for what it is. There's no judgment. You know, a caterpillar is a caterpillar, a pig is a pig, a plant is a plant. It's never not going to be anything but the experience. And around the age of seven he's going to come back into this alpha brainwave state, dominant, that we live in, where all of a sudden his ego comes online. But even as he approaches the age of seven, you're going to start hearing him say no, no, I want to wear this shirt instead, and he's going to want to cross the street without mom there. He's going to want more autonomy. That's important. That's part of our human experience and development. The quote unquote problem is that we move into this egocentric state which we need to live in to be humans and I have my own take on that spiritually, but to be humans, and I have my own take on that spiritually, but to be humans. And then what happens is, as his brainwaves change, he all of a sudden begins to not only bring autonomy to himself, but what is the type of little boy he needs to be at home. So now he's going to really be able to tune in, not consciously, like, oh I wonder what my dad and mom's relationship like, or mom and dad, and how's it happen and what happens with this. It's only going to be learning through modeling, so he's really going to get the downloads. So if he sees pops showing all the emotions, then he's going to be informed in him, in his own identity, that he can show all the emotions. But let's say you were and I know you're not the worst dad in the world, right, and you were coming home and your wife was taking all of your abuse and it was a really dysfunctional family. Well, there's going to be parts of that child that isn't going to be able to be expressed, which is really sad, right, because they're going to need to swallow their anger, or maybe swallow their sadness, or maybe anger and sadness, because that's not allowed in the household, because it's very triggering to the parents.

09:42 Or he sees that when dad expresses that it's not safe, when mom expresses that it's not safe, that's problematic and it becomes downloaded into the child's identity.

09:52 So the child starts growing up saying this is how I am, this is me. I've never really cried I'm a big boy now Whatever signals they got, and it goes into their adulthood and then it becomes problematic, especially when he marries a woman or is with a woman who wants more emotional availability or emotional vulnerability and he doesn't know how to show it. It's in there but he never knew how to express it because he never unlocked that part of his body and it creates a problem with his future children and his job and all of these issues come and then he goes to therapy and tries to talk about it, when in reality it's about getting deep into that child or now that adult man, getting deep into his nervous system and going back to those moments when. How about the times that you weren't allowed to show anger and you created the people pleaser identity around it? Because that is only a compensatory reaction to that. So the psycho identity part is that reflective what's going on in the inside somatic nervous system part wow.

10:55 - Chase (Host) It makes me think immediately how much of our lives and to some degree I'm familiar with this, but how much of our lives then really can we take ownership of until that age seven? So it's kind of like are we all just predestined to go through this trauma-fused waters for the first seven years and so, no matter what, we all have seven years at least of work to kind of go back and focus on.

11:23 - Christian (Guest) If there was ever a goal, it's for your nervous system to come back to the safety. It was very much so present when the child was in his age one through seven, but that's not to say that still, environmentally, he wasn't getting the cues that his parents were fighting right next to him when he was in the crib. There's still that signal. It really comes back to the household. How was the environment designed? Was it safe or was it an unsafe environment? Because ultimately, the nervous system needs that safety to be able to process and really fully be authentically expressed. And that's the goal of, like, all health, all health. If you have an unhealthy, dysregulated, imbalanced nervous system that is going to persistently fuel every dysfunction that you see, mental and physical health issues, if you have a chronically dysregulated nervous system, it's really hard for you to eat healthy food and your system not to see that as enemy, because everything you put in there, your system's freaking out over, your system is hypervigilant for threat. And so to me, I'm not saying I have any roots of anything, but I think that every doctor should be trained, as the first question, to be able to ask how is this person's nervous system, is it regulated Right? And they should be able to sense that.

12:43 I teach my students how to do this, how to sense people's nervous system. Where are they at on the spectrum and where do they fall? And if someone's chronically sick and they're doing all of the supplements and the diet and they've seen all the doctors and the biohacks and they spent all the money and they're still not getting better, I promise you it's in the nervous system and they're still not getting better. I promise you it's in the nervous system. And if it's in the nervous system it can be overcome. And if it can be overcome, that's when you start seeing miracles, change and I've seen it with my own eyes. I've done so much somatic work that I've seen changes where people had chronic eczema, infertility, chronic gut issues, chronic thyroid issues, chronic pain, gone since they were kids or young adults or whatever it is. And it's because the body remembers. The body remembers everything and if you don't express it, it needs to go somewhere and it builds up in the body, in the fascia.

13:33 - Chase (Host) I think, um, I I think the difficulty here for a lot of people might be I don't know where or how to address this, because I don't know what is there, and so it's kind of like, you know, if we have a external manifestation of disease or a rash or an allergy or an injury, even like we know it's.

13:55 It's a an acute response to an injury or illness, right here, right now, like here's the irritation, here's the thing we can focus on. But with this kind of stuff, I'm understanding is we don't really know what is there. We don't know why it got put there or the environment in which it was laid down. So then, how can I be responsible for, how do I even know how to navigate to get to a place of of illness that one I can't see, but I do think I'm having these kind of quote somatic manifestations too. Can't see, but I do think I'm having these kind of quote somatic manifestations too. So how do we even begin to get on the path of healing if we don't?

14:30 - Christian (Guest) know what the origin is, you break that exact thinking because that's the thinking that keeps you in your head and that's a thinking that keeps looking for the answer in the doing. But in reality, the healing comes when the body can process, in being. So we build the relationship looking for answers. Right, you need your logic and everything else. You want the answers and that's the therapy model. Not to say therapy is a bad thing, because it'll help with communication.

14:58 I always say that therapy will help you see the tree it's not going to get to the root. It can't get to the root. It can't Because if the root is repressed emotions in the tree it's not going to get to the root. It can't get to the root. It can't Because if the root is repressed emotions in the body then intellectualizing, talking about it and looking for that moment, finally for you to understand that aha moment, and thinking your whole life's going to change after that. It's not true. That's why people in therapy for years. Therapy works. You should be able to go in there, have a few sessions and then you're better, right?

15:31 The truth is it needs to be in integrative, complementary connection with a somatic practice. We don't need to look for the reason why. Actually, I can go as far as saying your body doesn't care about the trauma. Your body only cares if the signal in your brain is holding in the trauma and if you're safe enough to express that part of you, yes or no. And if your answer is in my identity I'm only going to be this person who doesn't cry or doesn't get angry or doesn't show fear, shame, guilt, sexual repression, whatever it is that we're holding in. Then, guess what? Your body is going to follow suit. It doesn't care about the trauma, it doesn't care about what happened, the details. We care, we want to know, we want to go through it, we want to be seen and heard in it. But the truth is the body's just like am I safe to express all parts of me, yes or no? And this is the biggest thing. This is the biggest thing Can you be all of you? That's it. And if your identity has not allowed for you to be all of you because that was a signal that from an early age you can't be all of you then all of your nervous system dysregulation is going to be mostly driven by this emotional repression. There's other things that dysregulate your nervous system Some foods, circadian disruption, all those things too. But the biggest, biggest glacier, the biggest anchors to nervous system dysregulation are repressed emotions or repressed parts of you, because the emotion is a part of you. It's a part of you that needs to be seen and wants to be seen. So when we say, yes, you are angry, just as your love, you're able to be all the light, we celebrate the light. You're a good dad if you're all the light. But what about all your darkness?

17:03 People want to be seen in their darkness. That makes us human, but we fucking hide it from every single person, especially our partner. What does a woman want? A woman wants to be seen in all of her and she wants to be held in the masculine as all of her right. So she wants to hear the man. You can be, you, you can cry, you can scream, you can love, you can be joy. I love you for all of you. That's transcendent for love, that's transcendent for a relationship. But that's exactly what we as men want, right? We also want to be seen in all of our pain. We want to be seen in the shit that we're holding in and having to dredge through for the family, or the things that we had to go through when we were young, and until we're seen by another, but mostly by ourself, until we see that our nervous system is never going to have the signal that it's okay to just be and be regulated.

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19:37 Safety You've been saying that word a lot and I think on surface level it's like oh, safety can look like this. It can look like a place, it can look like a safe home, a safe job, a safe relationship, a safe, even mental space. But safety is not always a place, it's a state of being. Is it a combination of both? How can one get to this place of safety so that we can really begin this somatic healing?

20:02 - Christian (Guest) Yeah, it's a great question because it is a signal and the way that I think about the nervous system is it's always, every second, even in the same room, if you don't leave the room, is still taking an audit of am I safe? And it's going through the fascia right, the nervous system, through the fascia, it's sensing and the eyes, the senses, sensing if it's safe. So if you and I get out of this room and we walk in the hallway and we go to the street and there's someone crossing us, you might feel safe with that person crossing you. But maybe something about the way that person walks that is not consciously aware to me, or maybe the color hood, or maybe there's a writing of the brand of the hood that reminds me of something that happened with a guy wearing a white Nike hoodie when I was in fifth grade, but I'm not conscious of it.

20:49 Guess what my body's going to do? It's going to contract and be in a bracing pattern to prepare for something to happen. So this happens every single day. Now, based on my childhood versus yours, I might be more hypervigilant. So it only takes just a little bit and my body's contracted and then we're walking and then I'm fine and then my body's relaxed and then I hear a honk, but it's very specific type of honk and my body contracts Meanwhile.

21:12 - Chase (Host) You're just chilling More of the story Don't go outside. Don't go outside right.

21:17 - Christian (Guest) But this message goes out to all the people who are hypervigilant. You know, the people who are in a restaurant and they're always looking around where's the exit. Is that person okay? There's a loud sound and they jump to the top of the ceiling and you're like, whoa, are you okay? What's going on? Why are you so on edge? And that's just how they are. It's because a part of the brain called the limbic system is hyperactivated.

21:35 But these come in signals and it's environmental and personal. The nervous system is taking in inputs from your environment, so it could be the guy walking in the street or the sounds, but it also can be chemicals that are coming from wood or mold in the air and how sensitive you are, that these are all signals. But the internal relationship is so important, right? If you're going continuously to a job because your sense of self-worth is not anything more than I don't deserve to be in this job, I deserve to be in my creative expression, I deserve to be in my purpose, then what do you think that's doing to your system? That's probably causing more damage than any mold exposure, any chemicals, anyone on the street, any sounds. So it's really the internal relationship and the decisions you've made based on who you think you are. That is causing those consistent nervous system dysregulation, repressions, not only just job relationships.

22:32 A lot of people are with a partner who they know they should have never married or they shouldn't even be in relationship with, but they still think my worth is only this partner. I don't deserve anything more than that, because that's the identity they've created and they're consistently in a nervous system dysregulated environment, probably repeating generational trauma, just like their parents did. It's not by mistake. We take our parents' models and ideals in the same way and see that as love. But until we have a connection with ourself and actually ask ourself what do I want in this moment and actually feel your truth, because your body is going to talk to you and your soul is going to talk to you through your body.

23:09 What is true for me? Do I want broccoli or do I want a bowl of cereal? Well, broccoli is healthier and that guy on Instagram said it. But my God, my body, my heart, I feel it in my body that I just want to comfort food of cereal and that's going to be better for my nervous system. Wow, that can really change the game. Can you do that with people now. Can you do that with your job? Can you do it with decisions you make right? Can you do it with your purpose? This is how you begin to change your life and your nervous system. That's when you start seeing miracles physical and mental miracles. When people start choosing themselves.

23:50 - Chase (Host) What do you think is one of the biggest, if not the biggest, red flags when it comes to us consciously or subconsciously lying to ourselves about a relationship, a job, a place, a state of being that is unsafe, but yet we keep showing up anyway?

23:59 - Christian (Guest) The biggest red flags is is there's so many it's like I love him, I love her? Is there's so many it's like I love him, I love her? Because oftentimes it's not conscious, you're not saying I'm not worthy. Therefore, I only deserve to be with this person.

24:16 - Chase (Host) Well, we're not really maybe not most of us we're not actually saying that we're not actually saying it right. Because why? But we're acting out of it.

24:19 - Christian (Guest) Yeah, because it's input in our identity. That's what I'm trying to say is, if you're living in this identity and it's been there for 20 plus 30 plus 40 plus years, then it's the way you operate. It's the way that you think your system operates, because you never ask yourself whoa, what is true for me reserves the highest level of love, the highest level of soul purpose, the highest level of joy, and not choosing anything below that vision or whatever I wrote out, and never making any concessions. Instead, we're going oh well, this is what I went into and I fell in love with him or her, or I went to this job and it pays the bills.

25:00 - Chase (Host) Just settling.

25:01 - Christian (Guest) Settling, but it's such a but what a settling. Settling, but what a what a. It's such a painful way to live because you can't fool your nervous system. Your nervous system knows damn well every time you abandon yourself and if you keep abandoning yourself, every single day, little by little, that stress and baggage is coming to the nervous system, which modulates your hormones, which modulates your hormones, which modulates your immune system, which modulates every organ. And then, when you're 50, 60, 70, 80 years old, all of a sudden this chronic disease starts, comes out of nowhere and you go where did I get lung cancer from? I never smoked. You got it because you're in a chronic state of nervous system dysregulation. It's not like woo-woo stuff.

25:40 There's mechanisms behind this and what I'm submitting to people is that now, right now, is the time to truly look and say am I abandoning myself or am I being truly in alignment with what I deserve? Even if you're faking it till you, make it Work with your nervous system while saying I deserve the best partner, I deserve the best job and what is? Define it for yourself, define best, define sole purpose, define your creativity. If you don't know what it is, follow your excitement. The things that make you. Excited is the way that your nervous system is talking to you. Listen to excitement and discern if it's excitement coming from pathological anxiety excitement, addictive excitement, or if you're quiet still and there's peace. On the other side of that excitement, there's expansion, not contraction, in the body. Your body's going to talk to you If you follow excitement, if you're lost with everything and you don't learn anything in this podcast, it's to follow your nervous system signal and it's excitement, it's joy.

26:39 - Chase (Host) How is there really like a litmus test you would give people for to not chase false leads through this course of healing, or leaning into what could heal my nervous system?

26:49 - Christian (Guest) What does my nervous system?

26:50 - Chase (Host) really need? Is it absolute? This kind of feeling is a yes. This kind of feeling is a no. Is there some kind of physical manifestation we can be looking at of all of a sudden?

26:59 - Christian (Guest) I'm feeling better, my skin is better.

27:01 - Chase (Host) What are these kind of telltale signs we can look at to go like I am on the right path, or this is me just trying to force the right path?

27:08 - Christian (Guest) Every person is going to be different in their own signature of how their body expresses to them. And if you, the only responsibility you have is to begin to build interoception, the sensation and connection with your body, you might, in two hours from now, be like I'm hungry. That's interoception. If I'm in this room and you got the AC blasting, I'm like, oh, I'm cold, that's interoception. It is the body signals to the brain saying this is how you feel. The felt sense is feeling that in the body, feeling it move, feeling what is the texture of it? Right, you need to be good at both in order to even begin understanding the language and learning the language of the body. And so, if you don't create a relationship with your body, most of your decisions are going to be made from your ego, ie your identity. It has to be, because that's your operating system. But the only way to transcend the operating system is to shut it off and drop into your more powerful, more sophisticated, more efficient, more rewarding operating system. And that's the one in your body. Not to say there's not a place for the logical operating system, but we're 99% there, maybe 1% in our body when we're sleeping, when we're eating, when we have body when we're sleeping, when we're eating, when we have sex, when we're working out, when we're playing sports, when we have a flow moment, when we're playing guitar or something like that. But the rest of it we're 99 percent. What I'm submitting is that most of our decisions come from our body, because it will never lie, ever. It will never abandon you, it will never lie, but it's our responsibility to come back to it. Your child, in three years from now, you're going to see how clear his connection with his body is, because he's going to poop when he needs to poop. He's going to fall and he's going to cry and he's not going to look around to see who's going to be judging him right. He's going to eat when he needs to eat. He's going to follow his intuitive, interoceptive signals and he's going to have that felt sense, that connection to his body. And around the age of seven we lose it. It's okay, but it's about coming back to that relationship.

29:11 So people love meditating. I love meditating. Meditating is great and you got to meditate into your body. We meditate to leave our body and go into the world of spirituality and spiritual realms and heaven and whatever it is, it works and there's proven benefits to the brain, and we got to learn how to get into our body. Because guess what I mean? I've worked with this spiritual meditation teacher. He was very successful and ran a big meditation organization and he had no idea about somatic work and he had no idea how much sadness and anger he had in there that was literally affecting his health. So he was physically unwell but he was spiritually A plus elite, right, and how many people are like that?

29:55 So what I'm saying is you got to come in your body and when you come into your body and align with what's happening, you make decisions from your body. You'll make the decision on what's true for you. Is it really true from your body that you want broccoli or is it really true from your body that you just want that bowl of cereal that reminds you of when you were in fourth grade? There's no wrong here. Your body will know. And that's when all of a sudden healthy and unhealthy becomes kind of hazy in the context of food, because sometimes your body just wants that cookie from when you were younger and that's okay. You don't have to go to your ego and go no, but I'm not the person that does this. It's not part of my identity, it's not who I am. No, your body wants that joy. Through that expression, you'll live. Same goes with relationships, same goes with jobs. It's a full, comprehensive compass that we forgot, that we even have.

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32:18 I personally have not found anything from Caldera Lab I don't love. I've been using pretty much every one of their products since 2018. I love them. I wouldn't recommend them if I didn't. I love products that work and also I love saving money. So here you can get both C-A-L-D-E-R-A-L-A-Bcom calderalabcom. Check out code ever forward for 20% off your entire first purchase. Your future self and your hairline will thank you. I think you were kind of hitting on it here, but I want to ask you directly. I love this aspect of developing or redeveloping a relationship with our body. I think there are a lot of us that maybe on paper, are doing all the things right, doing all the right things.

33:01 We're exercising, we're doing yoga, we're doing breath work, we're meditating, we're sleeping. You know we're having good self-talk, but on the other side of the spectrum there are people that aren't really doing any of that, and I think there could be a case made for either track, that you're getting the same result, whether you think you're doing good stuff or you're not doing anything. If it's not the right intention or the right modality, or you're forcing it for the wrong reasons, then you're not really going to develop that relationship to the body, because it's not genuine, it's not authentic, it's not what your body.

33:34 - Christian (Guest) It's not genuine, it's not authentic, it's not what your body it's like.

33:34 - Chase (Host) we're trying to tell the body what we need for the relationship instead of the body telling us what we need for the relationship. So then can you walk us through maybe, what do you think are general blanket saving here, good practices for someone to get into or maybe even some to let go of to really establish a healthy, true, genuine relationship with their body?

33:49 - Christian (Guest) I love this question because this is actionable stuff. This is why people listen right, really take an audit first of all. Of like to start getting healthy and healing. You have to be clear on if you want to first of all.

34:04 - Chase (Host) Oh Right and it's true, right?

34:07 - Christian (Guest) Yes, you got to be clear. Because if you're unclear about it, or if being sick gives you more value, without judgment, if being sick gets you more love and attention and value versus being healthy but you say you want to be healthy, the truth is you want to be sick and that's okay. But if you really truly get to the point where I'm suffering, my relationships are suffering, my work is suffering, my physical health is suffering and your health matters, then it's really important to begin to lean into what health is going to give you. Can you go back to that part of you that felt the need to be loved when you're sick? Can you go back to that part of you and actually look, be loved when you're sick? Can you go back to that part of you and actually look?

34:53 It's probably a young inner self, right, a young child inside of you that maybe when you were a kid and you were sick, that's the only time your mom or dad gave you attention and there's nothing wrong with that. But you need to visit, you need to connect to your body and go hey, listen, I have compassion and love for you. Like, if sickness gets you, got you love. I understand, and up to this point it worked and I got you. Now I got this. I got you Connect every single day to that part of you that really needed that, to be sick, as you ascend to this other part of you that says I'm ready to be healthy, I'm ready to take control of over my full spectrum of my human experience and my health, my mental health, my physical health, my spiritual health, all parts of me, my relationships.

35:37 And so that's the first step you got to be clear on do you want to be healthy or do you want to just be better? Do you want to live better? Do you want to feel better in your body? Do you want your nervous system to be better? And once that's clear, then the tangible work is rebuilding that relationship with the body. We've abandoned it, especially by going into our head and our compensatory mechanisms. When we were young and we were unsafe, we learned how to be in our head and there's different compensations. Some people are workaholics and society celebrated you living in your head. Some people are super logical, intellectual. That's great. I also worry about those people. I worry about high intellectual people is because I worry that their interoception is really poor.

36:23 - Chase (Host) Like they're so in their head.

36:25 - Christian (Guest) They're so in their head. I've created these archetypes over seeing almost a thousand patients somatically, and the people that are in their head are called the numb archetype. These are the people that learned how to live in their intellect. A lot of men are numb, live in their intellect and abandon their body because in their body is a massive reservoir of pain Could be women too, but a lot of men Massive reservoir of pain, and so they learned how to succeed and intellectualize their human experience when in reality their human experience wants to be felt through the nervous system authentically. And so these people are often.

37:03 Jordan peterson is is that he's? He's a stiff, you see him, and he's super intellectual and for sure, yeah, right, but but I but I remember seeing a video of him at a bar dancing and he was so stiff. Stiff people are the people you want to kind of grab and shake and be like loosen up, like yeah, have fun, it's okay, you can move your shoulders, you can move your spine, you can move your hips, but they don't know how to because there's a lot of repression, oftentimes sadness, but oftentimes sexual repression too, and I would say Jordan has both. And so, speaking on that, it's about reconnecting to the body. And so how do you do that?

37:40 Well, anyone could go on YouTube and look at a yoga nidra. Yoga nidra is going to help you ground yourself, toe all the way up to your head and maybe back to your feet. But this is about having the bottom up experience, body first experience. How many people viewing and listening right now? When's the last time you felt your right toe? When's the last time you even knew you had a right toe, unless you had a cut or a bruise, or you broke it, or your kid bit it when he was on the floor?

38:07 - Chase (Host) right or anytime I'm doing tree pose and yoga. Tree pose and yoga Anchors the leg down on one side.

38:12 - Christian (Guest) Yeah, so exactly. But what about if you can build your sensitivity to immediately? When I say, feel your toe, you can feel it at a 10 out of 10. Like your awareness can drop flow, you can feel blood flowing into it. You can feel tingling For those of you right now who can do that great. You have strong interoception, more than a stiff right.

38:34 And what about the rest of your body? What about the parts of your body that are sort of the zones that you don't want to go near? Maybe it's the upper right, belly right. Maybe it's the upper left belly. Maybe it's the chest, where we hold a lot of sadness. Maybe it's the womb where a lot of women hold anger, sadness, sexual oppression and shame. Maybe, for men, we have shame there too. On our pelvis, lower back, there's a lot of guilt. Can we actually feel that, or does it feel frozen?

39:04 If we're not able to feel parts of our body, that's already a signal that your body, your ego, doesn't want to feel that part of the body, because there's something there. So the more that you drop into your body as a practice, just like a yoga practice, just like a meditation practice, the more you, every single day, create a relationship with the body, something magical happens. It begins to trust you, it begins to finally open the door and say, hey, okay, you can come inside. And when you reestablish that trust oh, my God, the things your body shows you. And that's when the processing happens, because the body starts to take over. So there's a breaking point. You do it. You do it for every day, 30 days, 40 days, maybe some. For some people two days. Maybe they have good interoception already.

39:43 But there becomes a point where the body trusts you. You drop into the body, you tune into the tension that you're feeling, or where your body already wants to bring you. Your body's going to tell you. If you close your eyes, I can feel right now. Oftentimes on my upper left belly it feels contracted. Today it doesn't. Today I feel good. Today I know that I'm not holding in fear, because I know fear can be the emotion that I hold in the most and I know exactly where my body is. But how about us? What emotion that I hold in the most? And I know exactly where my body is. But how about us? What about everyone else? Where do you hold the emotion that is your most susceptible with? And most people it's like an onion. Most people haven't integrated any emotion since they were kids.

40:24 So what they're going to find is when the body begins to trust you, it begins to show you and you begin to bring your awareness and meditating into the body. Oh, my God, the body takes over. That's when, all of a sudden, you take a breath and your whole body starts shaking. You start twisting and turning and it moves through your body and through breath and sound. You make sounds in accordance to what's in there and you begin to process. That's when you go. Oh my God, I've never felt anything like that. I got to DM Chase. I got to DM Dr G and say what the hell did I just go through? You went through a massive nervous system healing and guess what? There's probably more layers. It took me four years, without any guidance, just intuition, to peel these layers back and it was sadness, then anger, then sexual oppression, then fear, then shame. That's it. And I had to go through all of them and sometimes the shame one is still creeping up a little bit. I'm like, oh, there's still some stuff in there.

41:20 - Chase (Host) Yeah, does it ever really fully go away?

41:23 - Christian (Guest) It's not about going away, it's about reintegrating.

41:26 - Chase (Host) I see.

41:26 - Christian (Guest) It's about me in those moments going oh shit I am angry.

41:33 My God, I thought I was just like a pleasant guy, but I'm also an angry guy and I actually not thinking it, I'm not saying it, I'm feeling it. I'm feeling the part of me that is angry and going. I love you. You're allowed to be here Just like guilt, just like shame, right, All these parts of me, all the things that I felt bad about that I've done in my life. I needed to feel bad and sad and heavy and almost hopeless in that experience of my body processing and go. I'm allowed to feel this and I love you. I love you even in your worst Christian. I love you even in your dirtiest and your angriest, in your most guilty, but also in your most love and your most joy.

42:12 If that's not true, what it means like to be a human and I'm not saying here I am being a human, but I'm saying we all deserve to be all parts of us. We deserve to be that darkness and seen and loved in it as much as we deserve to be in the light, where we only really show society and our partner. And this is health when you can be all of you. It's called authenticity, but this is health because that's when true purpose flows through you.

42:38 - Chase (Host) I think you've said this word parts, a few times and I think that is such an important area to hone in on. Parts. I'll also translate that as periods of time, parts of us, versions of us, past, present, future, self Speaking personally, I would love to get your take on this. I think it can really be beneficial, especially to kickstart work like this. But also to really go deeper is to address a time period of yourself College, you, junior high school, you, your parents going through a divorce, you to really kind of like compartmentalize or to segment and then compartmentalize the work. Do you think that is where maybe it's an easier start for certain people or might be a good idea to go to, because there probably is something there and kind of these more segmented, quantified periods of our life versus just like wrapping my head around? I am all of these things right now. I'm trying to just sort through it all.

43:30 Should I just go to like a segment first.

43:33 - Christian (Guest) Again, this is the energy of intellectualizing, right? This is we want to go to a part of our life looking for something when, in reality, our body will show us. Our body is going to show us, if it wants to, that moment that happened in college, but it doesn't need to because it can just have us experience guilt as a whole instead of going but remember that moment. But remember that moment and then showing you all, if you, if it wants to show and I, and it did for me it showed me a few moments where I was like holy shit, I was out of integrity. Oh my God, I feel really guilty.

44:05 - Chase (Host) Can you take us there, like when you said it showed you, like, was that? Were you having a flashback? Were you having imagery? Was it a sensation?

44:10 - Christian (Guest) Yeah, the body is a subconscious. When we talk about getting into the subconscious that we try so hard and desperately to do in psychology, it's the body. The body holds the collective subconscious of the body, of the whole human right. The conscious is the parts of you that you think you are and the identity, the conscious experience, the subconscious experience is actually what drives your human experience more than anything. The subconscious. So those are your beliefs. But where do your beliefs come from? They don't just arise in the brain. They come and they're informed by what's happening in the body. You're informed by what's happening in the body. So, again, if you're holding in a ton of grief because you've done a lot of out of integrity things of all around your belly, because there are generalizations, and then witnessing that part of you that is guilty as a whole and saying I love you you did the things that you thought were exactly true in that moment and I love you you are allowed to be guilty. Christian Chase, whoever's listening, you're human.

45:28 You're allowed to be that dark and when you see and witness that part of you, something beautiful, magical happens. It reintegrates into the conscious experience. So now, when you come out of your body's experience, you're walking around and go, okay, yeah, I can be guilty, you know, or I can be angry, and now your nervous system has a brand new signal. You're up-leveling the iOS system of your nervous system and going, hey, you needed an update since 1994. I can't believe you've never had an update right and this is how it changes. It doesn't have to be driven by these things in these moments in time to relive that moment. The body will take over and show you, but you have to be able to build that muscle. It's not a muscle, but muscle of interoception. I've heard you mentioned body parts a few times now.

46:14 - Chase (Host) Um, now I don't know if that's just relative to you, or do you feel like certain traumatic events or certain things, certain emotions that people will hold in, uh, or just not acknowledge, are stored more often in certain parts of the body. So walk us through like if I've got low back pain is that because I'm more likely storing this kind of trauma or this repressed emotion. What is the physical location have to show us about? Like the emotional, it's the juicy stuff.

46:41 - Christian (Guest) Yeah, chinese medicine was right, man. For the most part, at least in my experience, chinese medicine was right. They have an emotional map of where meridians of energy, which are really just the fascial flow of energy. Energy moves through the fascia. We are energetic beings. The characterization of emotions that they had are pretty accurate into what I've seen, and so I've seen a lot of people somatically and you begin to see patterns too. So I'm like here, I am writing down. I was like, okay, fear again is over here. Sadness here, okay, and anger tends to be over here. Anger, almost unequivocally, is in the belly somewhere. It's oftentimes upper left part of the belly, around the liver. That's where Chinese medicine said it was. That's where I often see it, although I've also seen it lower than the upper left quadrant and it can be in the middle of the belly or the lower part of the belly.

47:35 - Chase (Host) I just had a Chinese medicine doctor on recently. We were talking about stem cells shout out Dr Joy Kong she was talking about she grew up in the Chinese medicine world and I think, beijing Um, and talking about how she learned about this as a kid. And anytime she would get angry she would immediately go oh, like my liver. I don't want my liver to get sick, so she would suppress feeling angry anytime she was a kid because she didn't want it to get sick. Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent. It's wild.

47:59 - Christian (Guest) So, so, um, and sadness almost unequivocally is in the chest and in in in the lungs and the chest area there's, it's always there. Um, um not to name people's experiences because, uh, I'll have people go. I'm really sad right now and and they're pointing to their belly and I was like, okay, I'm like the body's going to show them that it's not sadness. And then immediately they're like fists are closed, their faces right, they're like I'm just so sad. And then I was like okay, okay, yeah, and and we don't name it, we just let people see it themselves. But very soon they, they go, wait, no, I'm really angry. And then, and then it's expressing the. The shoulders tend to be really interesting. I find a lot of women have a lot of tension in their shoulders.

48:44 - Chase (Host) I've heard that.

48:45 - Christian (Guest) Massive amounts, man, and it's because they carry a lot. They carry a lot of weight, they carry a lot of responsibility. This is our role, this is our ego, the role you know, the people who fix who people please, who do everything for everyone and abandon themselves. Their shoulders are usually really, really, really tight and these are the ones who need massages all the time. The left side tends to be, generally speaking, the feminine side, so the right side being the masculine. Oftentimes it's relation to your own femininity and own masculinity, but more commonly it is your relationship to your mom or your sister or your partner and vice versa. For the women out there, the hips are the hips, and womb oh my God, the womb for women is is usually the final boss.

49:34 - Chase (Host) What's going on there?

49:35 - Christian (Guest) There's a lot going on. It's the final boss because, you know, usually there's a there's a common pattern in women and a common pattern in men. Not always. The common pattern in women is um, there's a sadness, first layer cause. It's more socially acceptable, right? So they're usually feeling something in their chest and they're really reliving something. They're just sad about their marriage or whatever. And then there's protection, and that protection might come as getting numb, getting cold, going into their head, thinking about things, abandoning their body, shutting down All those things are protection. Once we pass that because there's a way to pass protection, it's the same thing just giving awareness and love to it and being like thank you for being here and knowing that you're protecting yourself and there's nothing bad about it.

50:23 It's literally acknowledgement. The body's just waiting for your acknowledgement.

50:26 - Chase (Host) So, would you say, acknowledgement is the first step to healing.

50:29 - Christian (Guest) Always. And then anger is often seen in the women. So then they're talking about their bellies getting really tight. They're just tightening their faces, getting red their fists. And when women express that anger, holy shit, the whole building will shake. You have no idea and you might, but you have no idea how much a woman is repressing, because it's a generational thing, it's a societal thing. Oftentimes they're repressing their relationships, definitely repressed at work.

51:09 There's so much that a woman holds in, so when that comes out, that's one of the biggest heal. It's the second, usually final boss. There's usually a deep shame I'm not good enough, I'm not worthy enough, I'm not pretty enough, I'm not lovable enough, and that often expresses in the womb. The womb can also hold in anger and sadness as well, especially if there was an abortion, a rape, even a surgery, because surgeries are physical traumas too. Rape, even a surgery, because surgeries are physical traumas too. And my God, like the healing that I've seen in the womb is incredible. I mean, I've worked with a woman who's infertile, did a session, one session usually it takes a few one session and had a baby two months later. Yeah, because infertility, infertility, and I'll tell you why, and this should give us a clue that it's not just about nutrition. If this woman came to me ready to do IVF and she said this is her last resort and I said, great, okay, we're going to go into it. Let's see what your body says.

52:02 Immediately she goes through sadness, she goes through anger. I'm like, oh, this is so predictable, you know she goes through anger and I go there might be. And this is how it humbled me because I thought I knew it was going to happen. And then you know her belly and we go through that process. She screams and then I'm like, okay, well, there might be some shame and I'm not worthy to have a kid or whatever story. And this is a danger in somatic therapists we should never think we know what's going to happen because we get humbled.

52:27 But what happened was more anger started coming, but it came in her womb and she goes I can feel my upper right part of my womb contracting, like it's just spasming like a Charlie horse, and I go okay, so I put my finger on and I pushed down and I brought her awareness to it. She brought all of her head awareness. She wasn't thinking about anything else other than my finger pushing down and I told her to make. The sound of this pain under my finger and the sound I thought the anger release was something. This sound in her womb was something else. It was one of the most intense ones I've ever heard and it moved. It was like wailing, yeah, wailing pain, screaming, bloody murder, like movie, like horror movie, and I'm just like, okay, wow, this is moving. And the beautiful thing is this you know they move through it because they're sweating, but you can feel their nervous system sort of re-managing itself, reorganizing, and you know we talked, and then you, and then we integrated. She went about her way and then she sent me a message two weeks later and she's like.

53:39 I had a memory. My partner and I were going to be intimate and because we did the session, I noticed that every time he's about to penetrate me I close my legs, and she didn't even know she was closing her legs. Now this is where past and psycho comes up, because she goes and I remembered that this has been something that I've done with my body ever since college. This man that I was dating but didn't want to have sex with raped me. So can you believe this?

54:11 This woman's womb had the memory of her abandoning herself and or being forcefully made to have sex, and all of that unprocessed anger of she never said get off me, I hate you, get off me. That never came out. So where did it go? It went inside and it built up in her womb. So now, every single time her loving partner, who she loves, wants to have sex with her, subconsciously her whole system is rejecting him immediately. Wow. And then she had a kid. And then she got pregnant. Right. Then she got pregnant. Anyone who asked. She sent me the email. She said I can always publish it. It was like three months later she sent me a big email and I was in shock because I was like, wow, this was the first one that was like not pain, not autoimmune disease, not skin things, this was proper.

55:05 - Chase (Host) Like infertility, life, life.

55:11 - Christian (Guest) So I want everyone and I say that it's a little long winded, but I want everyone to understand that if you're not, if things aren't getting better, there's a nervous system piece there of an unprocessed part and for her it was just all of that anger and then the sadness after of her just not being able to stand up for herself and having to surrender to this aggressive man and imagine all the partners that she had, or the partner she had in all the time she's had sex, where her whole system goes nope, sex isn't safe. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, Even though she wants to have sex with this man. So, yeah, I say all that to say, yeah, lower back. Guilt, usually anger, shame, sexual repression in the womb, the neck and the shoulders is often anger and sadness masculine, feminine and fear is often in the kidneys, but it's also in the upper right belly. That's what I found.

55:59 - Chase (Host) That's incredible, profound, amazing, a miracle. And for me personally, like I can't not hear that and not get excited in a way, because it's like now we know what to do, and so I think that's just me. But I think for a lot of people they hear that and they go oh, that's scary. The work that I think is necessary for me to heal, to get to a place of true health and break past any of these identities, maybe that I've consciously or subconsciously created, limiting my health potential, my life potential that sounds like more work than I want to do.

56:37 I get excited about the work, but I've had profound breakthroughs so I kind of have this confidence feedback loop so I know if I do the work I get the healing. If I do the work, I get the healing to someone maybe, who is fearful of the work because of this traumatic event that might come back up, or this physical painful or emotional painful experience to relive or to have to go through. Maybe the truth, the juice isn't worth the squeeze, so to speak.

57:02 - Christian (Guest) What would?

57:02 - Chase (Host) you say to that person Like to get through the fear so they can actually step into true healing.

57:07 - Christian (Guest) Your body's never going to give you more than you can't handle ever. The only reason you would think that you can't handle it is because you've pulled away from your body, went back up in your head and go this is too much. Your body will never give you more than you can handle. It will never burn out your nervous system if you stay with your body. Your body knows exactly what to do. Yeah, you'll have a reflexive like I'm tired and I need to rest the rest of the day or I need to drink a lot of water, but you're not gonna burn out and have permanent damage. Your body will always process exactly to the level it needs to process. If I gave you my aforementioned layers that I've been holding in most of my life, why didn't I go through all the layers in one shot? Then, if my body said, hey, this guy's finally here with me. No, it said hold on. No, no, no, no, no. You need to cry. You need to go through all that sadness. Oh, my God, you don't even know what's under here. You need to feel that anger. It took me four years without any guidance. Before, somatics was even hot. Now we have programs. Now we have coaches. Now we have all these things, but ultimately none of that matters unless you can drop in your body. Your body is the smartest coach. Your body is the smartest healer.

58:45 Always Guaranteed Physical health, almost guaranteed for the most part, if it's not like a nutritional deficiency or poor diet or something in your home like you're breathing in mold or something. If you want better life, and then relationships, oh my God, I'll tell you right now I'll. All these repressed layers, what the hell do you think comes out in relationships, all those repressed parts of you. If you are repressing anger and you're people pleasing, you're going to attract a partner who is going to exactly hit with the right pinpoint bullseye those repressed parts of you. It's not by mistake we we attract partners who are exact triggers to those exact parts of us that are repressed. Why? Because the body's always looking to heal. Why do you think the person who is so is a people pleaser who's holding in a lot of anger? But people might not sense that, but I'll be able to see that easily and we can kind of sense that too. You know the people who are kind of like super nice but you kind of feel weird about them.

59:31 - Chase (Host) You're like they kind of feel like they're gonna blow up. Yeah, you're like you.

59:34 - Christian (Guest) Look at their eyes, it looks like there's some pain there. You know why do shitty things always happen to the nicest people like that. You go, they're so nice. When someone stole their car, they're so nice. They, you know like they're. Someone went into their bank account and hacked them. All these shitty happen and the reason they happen to these people who are so nice on the surface is because there's a massive layer of anger that wants to be expressed. They're attracting situations for them to process that anger. That's not by mistake. The body's trying to heal.

01:00:03 - Chase (Host) So you're saying we're doing it to ourselves.

01:00:06 - Christian (Guest) I'm going to. I'll say that we are responsible for 99% of our human experience. We're responsible for 99% without even knowing, unconsciously, things happen to us quote unquote that are extenuating circumstances, like a tidal wave, like an earthquake. But it also gives us the opportunity to redefine who we are in that experience, which in itself is healing. But back to that, to that expression in relationships. For me, if I was living with repressed sadness and repressed anger and repressed sexual shame and repressed shame for being out of integrity in my 20s and just being just not that nice to people you know, like what do you think I'm going to attract in a partner, I was attracting partners who were triggering all of that, all of it, and I was pointing my finger at them, going it's you, when in reality I was blessed with this opportunity to be like whoa. Let me turn that inwards and go whoa, it's me. How can I show up better? What parts of me are being repressed in this relationship? What parts of me need to be integrated so I feel more safe with myself?

01:01:12 and my partner Right, so important. And women like I said this in the beginning, women are coming into relationships with men with a huge, let's say, for example, father wound very common and if their father wasn't there for them, and these women are coming into relationships and they had to take over, I'm going to be there for me, since dad's not there for me. They're women are coming into relationships and they had to take over. I'm going to be there for me, since dad's not there for me.

01:01:34 - Chase (Host) They're having to step into their masculine they're having to step into their masculine.

01:01:36 - Christian (Guest) So what are they going to attract this man who's in his feminine and that's not by mistake. But that's also an opportunity for the man to redefine himself in his healthiest balance of masculinity. But that doesn't come with mindset work. That comes with integration of repressed parts of him so he can actually have a felt experience of who he is, so he can step into his masculine to complement and have his partner, who needed to overcome those father wounds in her masculine, finally feel safe that this man can hold her, all parts of her, take care of himself, all parts of her, take care of himself, take care of her, take care of the family.

01:02:14 This dysfunctional beginning relationship the first part of it, is not by mistake. Most people will go oh my God, we're not made for each other and we're going to break up. But it's a gift If you look at it. It's a gift Now, this man who heals, and if she's still in her dysfunctional, wounded part of her expressing in her identity and she doesn't want to grow with him, then the man can go okay, I've done work, I want to show up as the best man we're not matching. Then it's our right and our integrity to leave, but also what a gift we can give if we can heal together.

01:02:52 And I say all of that to say I'm in a relationship that is the most regulated by far relationship I've ever been. We don't trigger each other at all. We don't trigger each other. We speak with loving communication, our boundaries because we have defined boundaries, because we have defined sense of self. But a defined sense of self will not come if you don't see the parts of you that are holding back your sense of self will not come if you don't see the parts of you that are holding back your sense of self. You need to integrate those parts of you in order to even feel who you are.

01:03:17 And because I went through that onion and saw those dark parts of me, I know what matters to me and I know the parts of me that I'm never going to abandon again. And she knows those parts of me and she loves all of my darkness and she loves all of my light. That's unconditional love. And she knows those parts of me and she loves all of my darkness and she loves all of my light. Right, that's unconditional love when she I can actually say my partner loves the darkest, dirtiest, grimiest parts of me and the most beautiful loving parts of me, and she'll always accept me and vice versa. Like, do we deserve anything less Beautiful, beautiful, we don't.

01:03:47 That's the ultimate goal right there, that's the ultimate goal. Man, I love that.

01:03:54 - Chase (Host) I if we don't. That's the ultimate goal. Right, that's the ultimate. I'm so happy for you. Yeah, thank you.

01:03:57 But to speak personally to this whole kind of layer aspect, um, I've talked a little bit about it on the show already, but last year I worked through the most traumatic block of my life. I worked through this um traumatic death of my father and took me 19 years 19 years to actually literally physically show up to his grave site and have a smile on my face and be happy to see you dead and know that I'm on the other side of all this stuff. But, man, the layers that came next I couldn't even begin to describe or predict. Sometimes we have these major life blocks that once we do the work to allow them to pass through us, it just unlocks so many other things I was not prepared for and I was so on, like it was.

01:04:38 I was dumbfounded, I this was like a little bit of an ego check too, of I've done so much work in physical and mental resilience Like how could this be happening to me? Like I'm so out of control in terms of panic attacks and out-of-body experiences and just like that deep sadness you're talking about in the chest, just like inexplicably popping up all the fucking time and then, uh, you know, then choosing to lean into it and to go through all this next stuff. I mean, put me on my next healing journey for another 14, 15 months. Um, but just like, the layers, I think, are something that should not be taken lightly and like, and not to thwart anybody from starting a healing journey. Like, oh, what's on the other side? What? What if the next layer is even worse than the first layer? But, like, sometimes it takes, you have to pull back a layer or else you're never going to get to the next one, and the next one could be the one that you really need or the one that's really going to get you that healing, whole identity.

01:05:30 - Christian (Guest) It's crucial, yeah, and like there's and thank you for sharing that about your dad man because oftentimes we're going to keep being presented with these opportunities to be shooken up in order so the process can start. See, we have these moments of being shooken up so we transcend our thinking mind and actually feel, and there's a lot of men who are so numb that they actually have to hit rock bottom. Their partner needs to divorce them, they have to lose their job, they lose all their money or whatever matters to them, right, but whatever creates this like, oh my God, this is rock bottom. A rock bottom is for you to transcend away from your head and actually fucking feel the pain of what's happening. And sometimes we're so numb that we need to be shooken up and, unfortunately, sometimes those are deaths.

01:06:20 Right, it took you a long time to finally come to that because you didn't have the tools initially to just be like, hey, chase, like this is really serious and it's happening, and can we feel like, can you process this pain and let's be together and let's drop into the body. And you might not have had that model. Maybe you did, maybe you didn't, but regardless, it's exactly how it was supposed to be. You know, when my mom passed in 2011, it wasn't until 2020, 2020, that I went through that, that true emotional process. Right and and that's the plight of men we become really good at compartmentalizing, holding things in and moving forward right.

01:06:58 Every man has that quality and it's evolutionary right we're supposed to like keep moving forward and like foraging and getting everything and hunting and bringing back food for the village and our family Moving forward. That's why we have aggression right. That's aggression is moving forward and the true healed, like next level man is the man who can do all of that and actually drop into his chest and feel his heart right. It's like the warrior who can feel his heart, the protector who can feel his heart, the provider who can feel his heart. Unfortunately, most men are only the provider, warrior, and they forgot what it's like to feel. The problem is a dad or a man who can't feel their heart is never gonna be emotionally connected to their children, especially their daughter. You have no idea how many women I've seen that says I just wish I was able to connect with my father Damn.

01:08:00 - Chase (Host) It's that rampant.

01:08:01 - Christian (Guest) Huh, it's, it's across the board. I know if there's a woman listening and I know that this is really your touch. Like you, you feel this. If you feel this in your heart, there's a truth there.

01:08:14 If you feel anything I've said in this whole podcast, in your body. That's your body talking to you. Lean into it, right. So it's really important Like we as men, we build that interoception of feeling into our chest and, you're right, like it might be a really big layer that we have to go through, but like that's part of being a warrior, right?

01:08:29 We're supposed to feel this pain so we can show up better for our tribe, our community, our work, our purpose. And then you might cry a lot and then you might go through that crying and then you might get really angry and know all of a sudden that you're just pissed at your mom because of X, y or Z, or pissed at your dad, and that's okay, there's nothing wrong with that, because it just wants to be integrated. But don't push it away Like it's something to be moved through. You invite it and go like hey, I'm sad, I'm angry, I'm allowed to be. Come back to the hole, I'm sorry, I banished you. Yeah, like you're part of me and that integration is the key to health.

01:09:16 - Chase (Host) There's an inherent ownership part to this that we have to take into place as well. Yeah, so walk us through what you know. You've said somatic, we've talked about somatic. You know healing and the process a bit. You know there is a process, there is a modality to this. This isn't just what we're talking about and then, you know, go home and mull it over. There's an actual you know I don't want to call it procedure, but you know what does this experience look like and what can someone expect to maybe wrap their head around what they could experience no-transcript.

01:09:54 I immediately think somatic breath work. I've gone through somatic breath work. Is that what we're talking about? No, deeper, there's more.

01:10:01 - Christian (Guest) For sure. Here's my take on breath work Great way to move away from the thinking mind and into the felt experience. Great way and I've done it and I've seen people do breathwork, and breathwork is a fantastic practice every single day to drop into your body. But it goes deeper right. Like people who go through breathwork, I've seen some people cry and some people get angry. But the way that I see breathwork is it kind of touches the top layer.

01:10:37 - Chase (Host) Really.

01:10:39 - Christian (Guest) Just kind of touches it, but it doesn't even go through the whole thing You're saying.

01:10:42 it just kind of scratches the surface a little bit Of course, because you're actually discharging what's in the system right there on the surface. You are not going deep into everything. And unless the breathwork is held in a space where you're actually witnessing those parts of you, witnessing as they're coming systematically in a held container that is safe not in a group of people, but a held container that is safe, so you can witness those parts of you systematically, layer by layer by layer then it's not going to be integrated. You're just kind of moving energy out and that's not.

01:11:15 - Chase (Host) I don't think it works.

01:11:16 - Christian (Guest) It's not a bad thing, right, like dude, if you're stressed, like if you hadn't had the chance to work out, you'd be really stressed. You have a newborn, beautiful newborn, but you've been stressed. You didn't sleep that much. You've been running around. Your system needs to discharge that. Especially if you haven't been able to discharge that, that's going to be the first thing that moves in a breathwork. Now it could go deeper and you could, like, have a memory of your dad and then start feeling sadness, right, but what else? There's layers under that. There's protection, right, because all of a sudden, if that sadness starts encroaching on, let's say, your people pleaser and there's anger under that, you're going to stop, you're going to freeze during the breathwork, you're going to go, and then you're going to go.

01:11:56 Okay, I'm ready to go, right, and that you're not knowing that you're running away from deeper parts of you. Oh, wow. And it's more than breath, it's witnessing, it's dialogue. So somatic experiencing is is fantastic because it kind of brings you I'm not a somatic experiencing practitioner, but I know about it and I've done it. It brings you gently into these parts of you deeper and deeper and deeper, more powerful than breath work for sure. I've created my own modality, which I think is which is absolutely different than somatic experiencing. It's more dynamic and it, my opinion, goes deeper right.

01:12:36 - Chase (Host) Take me there, walk me through. What does it look like so?

01:12:41 - Christian (Guest) I learned different somatic techniques through 2021 and 2022. All of like the top ones. I wanted to learn what does somatics mean? And then teaching, teaching, teaching, learning, learning, learning, learning, all of it, right, teachers, and I'm writing it down and doing it. And then I started seeing people based on the one that I thought was like the strongest one. Then I started taking the things out of that one and adding something else in. Then I learned another thing and I'm like okay, well, I can use my hands and use fascia, work even deeper. Wow, that might even go deeper.

01:13:14 Somatic experiencing doesn't use your hands. It doesn't work with the fascia. But ultimately, I think the biggest thing that somatic anything is missing is sound, and we focus on breath. But breath is what mobilizes the energy. Sound is what moves it. Sound is what actually moves it through the body, so it's actually felt as a whole, but it gets stuck and I learned this because I woke up at 2 in the morning in 2021 with my body twisting and shaking and I was like what the fuck Am I having a seizure?

01:13:49 But I'm like okay, but I'm thinking about it. I can actually stop it if I want, but I don't want to stop it Cause I'm like my body's doing something and I remember this video of a bear that was tranquilized and then, when it came back to it, started shaking. All of that energy, the fear that it was when it was running away from the helicopter that tranquilized it and I go okay, my body's taking over and it's moving something and I felt it stuck in my throat. I felt it it was like a ping pong ball hitting a wall trying to move.

01:14:21 What a great thing to wake up to. I love this journey for you.

01:14:29 - Chase (Host) And then I used my sound and there was a sound, a very specific sound that I activated and moved it through the body.

01:14:33 - Christian (Guest) You made a sound, I made a sound, I made a sound. So then I go okay, what if I bring in this sound? And then I start doing this breathing, and then I start using these prompts and then, oh my God, the somatic practice skyrocketed and I started seeing like miracle healings, like the infertility, the eczema, the pain like, and I was doing it virtual and I was doing it in person and I was like holy shit. And then I started learning how to use my hands. So I teach people how to use their hands and what to do with the fascia, because the fascia is the key. Why the fascia is the key? Because that's where the emotions are, that's where they're held. When they say liver, it's not the organ, the liver, it's the fascia around the organ of the liver, because the fashion has the second most. The fascia has the second most sensory receptors, second to the skin. So, wow, so the fascia, which is saran wrap all over the whole body.

01:15:29 - Chase (Host) We know in science it's like that sausage casing.

01:15:31 - Christian (Guest) You know sausage case exactly cover the sausage, but it's everywhere it's, there's layers, it's not just one layer and it's what holds us together. When we walk right, it distributes um uh vibration. When we jump off of a, a ledge or something right, so our bones don't break, it equally distributes it through our body. But it also has the connection to intuition. Remember when I said when we walked outside and we see someone and he's wearing that shirt, the fascia through my eyes is sensing that before I consciously do that. So the fascia going close up, because it's connected to the emotional centers of our brain, it's saying close up, unsafe.

01:16:10 - Chase (Host) So it's kind of running independent of the brain. It is almost that's, before we consciously clock it.

01:16:14 - Christian (Guest) Before we consciously clock it, right, wow, and we might never consciously clock it, we might just go. Oh my God, my gut. Issues are flared up and I don't know why. Right, without understanding that there was a series of events through your fascia, we started bringing in sound, we started bringing in breathing, we started bringing in very specific prompts and putting together a whole practice and it became reproducible. I started teaching it to people. They started bringing in their clinics, started working well and we brought it into the integrative psychology institute. I've taught. Uh, by the end of this year we'll have, we'll teach like 300 people. So far, wow, this modality, right, and, and that's in less than a year and a half, damn so busy we've been busy, but like it's, it's fantastic.

01:17:06 It's fantastic and that's just a somatic practice where there's a cycle part. We teach them how to like, also integrate, and how to change your habits. If you have a big emotional release and you go through anger and sadness, fear, guilt, shame, and then you go home and your home is a mess or your job's a mess.

01:17:21 - Chase (Host) Yeah, I was going to bring up the integration component because I feel like any kind of major breakthrough like this like it's amazing, but you're so volatile usually after that and like it's the moments that come after that that really make it or break it, in my opinion 100% man Because imagine, like here's.

01:17:39 - Christian (Guest) Here's the problem. We are like a Mason jar that is three quarters filled with all of this emotional repression, these parts of us, since we were kids and our capacity is so small. Some people genetically have more capacity. Most people have a small amount of capacity that they're living with. So that's why they get overwhelmed and that's why they get really anxious all of a sudden or really depressed all of a sudden or shut down. It's our nervous system just responding to a lack of capacity.

01:18:06 And so when you come and you witness those parts of you in a somatic experience or somatic technique, that cup gets emptied, or half of it gets emptied, or 30% of it, and then how are you going to keep that cup empty? And there's different integration practices, right? So it's like. And then it comes back to relationships and your own somatic awareness of how you feel. In experiences I teach every one of my students and every one of my patients and clients I've seen it is their responsibility to have a somatic practice. I can't do that for them, but the ones that do absolutely change their life because they're making decisions from their compass. And that's the best gift you can have in healing is having a relationship with your body. So now they know I'm not there to tell them listen, that partner is not going to be good for you. I can't tell them I'm not their therapist. And even if there was a therapist, they may not make that decision based on their identity.

01:19:08 But if they feel it and they know in their body that this person isn't true for me and they know that their body's screaming at them because they listened to it in the somatic experience, that's a huge difference because it's a felt experience versus a experienced thought. Big difference. Felt experience you can't forget, you can't lie to yourself. With a felt experience, you can quiet it, you can ignore it because a lot, of, a lot of us do. But it's a felt experience. A thought is fleeing, comes and goes. We can, we can totally put it in the back and compartmentalize and never think about it again. But that's that's the best part for integration and there's other tools we give them, but it's it's the most important part of of breaking that habit is actually feeling what's true for you.

01:19:48 - Chase (Host) It almost kind of makes me think about, you know, I go through this experience and I have a breakthrough, and I think you will definitely know this once you're on the other side of it. But just preemptively thinking, you know, who am I to be this next person? Am I the most qualified person to you know, to accept this new download, to accept this healing, to accept this breakthrough, to be in a position of I now need to navigate clearly, a very specific thing, Um, but also in theory, like the rest of my life, like, am I qualified, Am I prepared to accept this new, profound state of being? Um, in an afternoon, you know, because you know you go out of that session, you go home to your life, your job, your relationship, you just go out to the car, Like the world in your world is probably radically different in a matter of what an hour, a couple hours an hour.

01:20:45 - Christian (Guest) And, and this is the biggest problem, is that life is not structured to celebrate people who are in their body. Right, we're not. If we celebrated people who are in their body, we'd be celebrating. We'd be paying yoga teachers a lot more money. We'd be paying dancers a lot more money, right. But instead we celebrate people who are in their intellect. Right, people who are using their intellect to build businesses, and that's not a problem, right, ai is great in many ways, right and Right.

01:21:15 What does connecting to the body do for society? Connecting the body does for society. It teaches people how to be in their own autonomous, true integrity of who they are Like. Imagine a world where people were connected to their body and their body said why are you an accountant? You always wanted to paint. Go, figure it out. You'll make it work If at the very least, be an accountant and paint. Right. But without the connection to the body, that signal never cuts off at 0%, it'll just be 1%. So it'll just be a fleeing thought before they go to bed, or it'll be a moment when they're walking in the park where it just all of a sudden comes out of nowhere. It's like oh painting school, I should paint one day.

01:21:56 And then they go back to their business. So what I'm trying to say is that if we connect to their body, we would be so much joyous of people, a collective right, because we're in our true expression. The soul will talk to us through our body and if our nervous system is repressed and contracted, we are not going to listen to the signals of the soul. And if we're not listening to the signals of the soul, we're not in our purpose. And purpose is the number one thing to being a human in this world.

01:22:23 I interviewed Anita Morjani and she died or she went into a coma and came back and I asked her what was the number one thing? Like, why, like, why did you get cancer? And she said the reason why I got cancer and I believe the reason why people get cancer and just disease is because they're not in their purpose. And by being out of your purpose your soul goes okay, it's not happening this life, we're good, we're done, we call it quits. Look, I'm sure there's people in their purpose who've had cancer, but that really stuck with me because I'm like huh, okay. So if someone's not in their purpose, then they are absolutely nervous system dysregulated. They have to be because they're not embodied and they're not embodying their purpose. Well, if nervous system dysregulation is real, then we're having constant states of inflammation. We're having constant states of endocrine and immune dysfunction, dysfunction all primers of chronic disease like cancer. So I'm over here thinking scientifically and she's just saying a blanket statement, but it still makes sense.

01:23:26 So what I'm trying to say is like, if we connect to our body, if there's anything that we can do for our health, is that because not only are we going to transcend our physical and mental health issues, not all. I'm not saying this is not in your story. Maybe you're supposed to have some of them. I'm not saying that. I'm not saying it's a cure-all. What I am saying for sure is that your life is going to change. It has to change. It has to change because now you have a compass telling you what is true for you and what is not. By making those consecutive decisions, you inevitably have a change in life.

01:23:57 - Chase (Host) You have to because you're listening to your body and guess what's communicating through your body, your soul, to kind of bring a full circle. It makes me think about is there a way to get ahead of this by doing somatic work in the first seven years of life? You know if we're spending, you know, so much of our adulthood. Maybe it's just me, but you know, it's kind of like unpacking and diving into all these past traumatic events and understanding our childhood and going through pain to get to our purpose and all the healing journey that we all go on. Um, is there a place for somatic work in childhood? Maybe not to, I mean, maybe not. We haven't really experienced a whole lot at that point. But at least just to start from a better place of mind and body connection, conscious and subconscious connection yeah it's about.

01:24:48 - Christian (Guest) It is two. It's two pieces. It's about making sure your child keeps their connection to their mind and their body Right, because they already had it. So these are questions like honey, what's true for you? Before you, we go to play and you see the swing and you see the slide. Let's take a moment, close your eyes, feel your belly. Okay, which one do you feel you really want to go to? Right now? I want to go on the swing.

01:25:18 - Chase (Host) Okay, what a beautiful question.

01:25:20 - Christian (Guest) Right, but giving them autonomy first of all. Giving them autonomy in itself is pivotable to childhood development because they're going to have a continued sense of self-growing, but also not letting go of the somatic experience, right. So, giving the autonomy what is true for you? Close your eyes, honey, or close your eyes, son, feel. What do you feel? Right now I feel kind of my belly hurts. Okay, great, we know that. That's information. Where does it hurt? Put your hand on your belly, right? They're continuously having that somatic sense. Okay, what do you need? They close their eyes and they go to run. Okay, I'll run with you. Let's go run outside and then check in on the belly.

01:26:00 They're continuously having that interoception and one of the things that really destroys interoception in children is when the child has to abandon himself and the child abandoned themselves, when the parents are dysregulated. So all that to say, you can do all those work, the somatic work, but it's going to continuously be sabotaged if the parents are dysregulated with each other and triggering each other and haven't done the work themselves. So you know, to bring in a child to this world, it's our responsibility not only to keep them connected to their body, but also do our own work and show up and model the healthiest version of us I was talking about the masculine and feminine. What is the healthiest version of you as a man? What is the healthiest version of you as a woman? As parents, can you break the generational stuff that your parents didn't so you don't bring it to your child and then your child abandoned himself because he doesn't.

01:26:52 The daughter doesn't see mom ever express anger in a healthy way. So then the daughter goes okay, that's a signal, I'm not allowed to be angry. And then there's words like no, you're not, we don't do this. A little girl doesn't do this. You're a big girl. Now you can't get angry. Those are all signals to the nervous system going this is not safe to be, this because if I am this, I won't get fed. Literally, it's survival. Yeah, yeah, yeah, mucking about. Oh my God, I was not allowed to show anger as a child. That's when the healing starts for them.

01:27:39 - Chase (Host) I love that answer. I mean, what a great reminder. And I think you know, if all this just check in, how much in our adulthood are we just really, you know, through healing, through wellness, through profession, through relationship, you know, once we get into a place of safety and all of that and happiness and purpose, how many of us are actually kind of just getting back into an alignment of what felt good as a kid, getting back to that childhood wonder and intuition. So it's rather than, what do we need to do to maybe to protect children from getting to this point? It's, what can we do to just or no, excuse me, instead of preventing, what can we do to protect? So, if we can just protect that state of being able to sit with your feeling, where do you feel it? Why do you feel?

01:28:21 - Christian (Guest) it.

01:28:21 - Chase (Host) And just know that that's a safe place to stay and let them run the course of their life staying connected in that way. Then might be out of a job later, I don't know, but that's, that's a great thing to have right. It's a?

01:28:32 - Christian (Guest) great thing and parents out there, you can always do your best, man, and it's like, as long as you're working towards regulating your system and you know, like getting uncomfortable but honest and true with your partner true, honest and true and taking accountability and noticing that moment when you want to react in a trigger, and then maybe just taking a moment, maybe if you need to walk out, reflecting. But can you and this is always the same remedy can you come back to your partner, feel your heart and then say your truth and love and then, as a partner receiving it, can I hold and respect that person's reality is true? And if that reality is true, no matter how preposterous it is, I love this person and I'm going to show up for this person. And if that person goes, you know what? That was my shit. You reminded me of my dad in that moment. I love you, honey, and even if I did, I'm here for you. Let's do this together.

01:29:28 What do you need from me? Okay, let me tune in. I think I need this. Okay, I'm here to support you. Just that is medicine. Just the man saying I'm here to support you and you can be all of you is already the medicine. That's the irony the woman doesn't have to do much. That's the medicine to feel safe in relationship.

01:29:46 So what I'm saying to parents is like we're going to fuck up. I'm not a parent yet, but I know I'm going to fuck up. But I'm going to do my best, with everything that I said, in order to raise a child. And guess what, when you fuck up, all you have to do is show up again in a secure attachment, as long as you take accountability with your child, no matter what age, and say my child, I love you, that was my fault, I shouldn't have yelled, I love you and hug them. There you go. That is the remedy for every quote, unquote mistake you make.

01:30:16 But you got to take accountability. A lot of us don't even want to do that with our own children. Oh man, and there's the healing. And that's how you raise children who are embodied and who don't ever abandon themselves and actually live healthy lives. And those are the child that change industries, they change communities because they're embodied human beings. And that's what we deserve as a community, as a society, right, people who are embodied. A generation, our generation, kind of missed the bubble. We're still working retroactively to fix things.

01:30:42 - Chase (Host) We're doing the best we can. We're doing the best we can. We're coming back.

01:30:44 - Christian (Guest) We're coming back right, but we can do right by our children.

01:30:48 - Chase (Host) Well, christian, this has been an amazing conversation I feel like so many of my conversations now being a new parent have. I can prepare to a certain level and have a certain level of of education and understanding, but, man, things are just hitting in such a different way Now. Being a dad like you have, like I, like I felt like my inner child was just like the whole time, just like soaking all this in in a new way. It almost kind of gets me worried sometimes about am I too aware of things you know? So I feel like maybe some of our parents before us, you know they were completely in the dark about all this stuff, and not emotionally, you know, present. And now this generation, maybe I worry, are we too kind of swinging the other way? But you know, to people like you, to work like you and experiences like this definitely has me a lot more present for how I'm going to show up for my life and my family my kid for sure.

01:31:40 - Christian (Guest) So thank you, Hell, yeah, man, it's a pleasure man to man, it's a pleasure for me to put this out there and whatever resonated with you and all the men listening, all the ladies listening, you know, like if you felt it in your body, just listen to that, right? If you felt nothing in your body and all in your head, then don't listen to me. Go look for someone else talking about semantics. That might hit that nerve a little bit. Better. Lack of better terms right there. So thank you for having me.

01:32:06 - Chase (Host) Yeah, man. Well, where can my audience go to like, maybe learn more about the somatic work? What do you got going on in the world? Where can they connect with you now?

01:32:13 - Christian (Guest) We created a master's program, created a master's program and, uh, for people who want to get certified in this, who want to become integrative therapists, we also have a somatic program for people who want to just want to be practitioners and not therapists. Two different programs one's a master's, one's a somatic course six months versus two and a half years, but it's all under the integrative psychology institute. Wow, um, I'm gonna give you so you could put in the show notes just a five-day somatic healing where we have a full somatic healing program where I help bring people to their body. You can put it in the show notes for people to do it. It's going to be really dope, okay, and then on Instagram is most of my stuff Dr, doc Gonzalez.

01:32:55 - Chase (Host) I've been doing this since our first podcast together in 2019, which is 2020, march 2020, 2020, which is a very different conversation toxins and yeah yeah, yeah, morning routines and morning routine, all that stuff, yeah, man, well, I mean one it's, it's just been. It's so cool to like see so many people grow and evolve over the years and you know, especially you, just you know, on your as a, as a doctor, as a, as a doctor, as a creator, as a podcaster, as a community leader and friend, like it's so cool just to see everybody's own personal journey being a personal healing journey, landing them closer and closer and closer, going through this filtration process of of your purpose and getting you face to face with the light and the dark. But then which is why I love bringing people like you on the show is like you didn't just stop there. You're like you, you're creating something out of it and because of it and for other people, so they're not stuck as well.

01:33:46 - Christian (Guest) Hell yeah, man. Thank you for seeing me.

01:33:47 - Chase (Host) I appreciate it. Yeah, man. Well, the last question, and I think I was asking this back in 2020, I have to double check but ever forward, you did. Okay, all right, cool, I think I started in 19, 2019. Yeah, so, um, now you know, in this somatic, your somatic era, um, what are those two words mean to you? Now, 2025, christian, what do you say? How do you live a life ever forward?

01:34:08 - Christian (Guest) Hell yeah. Um, you did ask this. This is such a cool question. I'm remembering. I kind of remember what I said last time.

01:34:15 - Chase (Host) I got to check the transcript. Yeah, yeah, check the transcript.

01:34:17 - Christian (Guest) So ever forward to me means moving forward in gentle love and compassion for yourself to witness the parts of you that has been desperately seeking your attention through physical and mental health symptoms, symptoms. Moving forward to witness those parts of you and love and compassion bringing it back to the whole so you can move ever forward in your life's purpose.

01:34:51 - Chase (Host) It reminds me of this kind of phrase of lived by a lot and it kind of started back when I was in my like clinical health coaching days and I was more like the physical trainer aspect and you know it was like I've got this nagging pain or this annoying whatever and it's like you know.

01:34:59 Then it turns into like a sprained ankle or a major injury. But now it's taking on a whole new meaning of like the mental and emotional and spiritual self and pay attention to the whispers your body gives you before they turn into screams. That's right, and we have whispers, we have so many whispers and unfortunately especially in this kind of work. I think we only start paying attention when it's a scream. And now maybe we have an opportunity to be a conduit for that scream.

01:35:28 - Christian (Guest) in the somatic work, a scream could be very healing. You can listen to the whispers. If you drop in your body, you're going to hear the whispers way years before. We're talking about this is proactive, preventative, prophylactic work. By dropping in your body, you will hear a whisper two, three years before it becomes a scream. Drop in there and notice what's happening in your body. Connect to it and notice what happens.

01:35:49 - Chase (Host) Beautiful. For more information on everything you just heard, make sure to check this episode's show notes or head to everforwardradiocom.