"It wasn't about what I was going to be know for, it was about what I was going to be known for activating in other people."

Jason Goldberg

Why does personal development, coaching, self-mastery, etc. seem to be so intense and even extreme sometimes? Can't we have fun along the way to optimizing our life? Jason Goldberg thinks so, and in fact he makes sure you laugh just as much as you reflect on your inner self so as to create your ideal outer world.

After spending over a decade in a successful information technology career, he left the corporate world to launch an award-winning transportation start-up followed by cofounding and serving as CEO for a tech firm in partnership with NASA to commercialize technology from the space shuttle program.

He now focuses all of his humor, experience and enthusiasm on being of deep service to inspiring individuals from pro-surfers to CEOs, and countless organizations.

Follow Jason @thejasongoldberg

Follow Chase @chase_chewning

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Episode resources:

Get Jason's book Prison Break: Vanquish the Victim, Own Your Obstacles, and Lead Your Life

Complete interview transcript:

Jason: 00:06:25 What's up brother? Welcome. Welcome. Welcome. Thanks for having me. Thanks for this. We had an amazing conversation before we ever did this. I know this has,

Chase: 00:06:31 I would love to, and you know, I reference that a lot on the shows like, Oh, before we were talking, you always hear that in podcast, land or conversations and it's true. Um, but yeah, I felt like that whole time, maybe some things maybe shouldn't been recorded, but, um, a lot of that conversation was just like, this is what I love about, uh, where I am in life in this profession and really just this platform. And it's just, it's just connection. And it's just, you know, Hey, what's my story. What's your story? What's your, what are your experiences? And we've like, we've been sharing stories and like helping each other in ways beyond just hitting record, man. So already. Thank you, dude. Thank you.

Jason: 00:07:06 Yeah, it's been amazing. I'm so excited to be here with you. We just, we just met in person for the first time recently and you know, I feel like I've known you forever as well. It's a Testament to how you show up in the world. I'm sure I'm not the only person that says that people probably meet you all the time. And like, there's just something about this. It's the East coast and you just go through, but either way, I'm just super excited to be here with you, man.

Chase: 00:07:24 Um, you beat me to LA by a year and as we're recording, I'm pretty much at my two year anniversary. You've been here for three, three next month. Um, what brought you to LA man while it,

Jason: 00:07:35 So I, I came here a lot for like speaking and everything else a lot, obviously a lot of stuff in personal growth happens in LA. And I do a lot of work with a company called mind Valley and they do a lot of stuff in LA. So I was coming out here every six weeks or so anyways, to do something. And then I actually went through a divorce. So I was on the East coast. I was living in Raleigh, North Carolina. I went through a divorce in 2017 and I realized, because I traveled a lot and stuff like that. And for some other reasons, I never really cultivated a lot of community in North Carolina. Uh, and Raleigh's a great city, but I just never, like, I cultivated a whole lot of community. And so when that happened and I realized I didn't really have a lot of community there, I started thinking to myself, where do I have community?

Jason: 00:08:11 And I had a lot of people here in LA that I felt really connected to. And I'm like, this is the time when I'm in transition and re-invention and transformation. This is the time I want to be around people that I know, like lighten me up and fill my heart up. And so literally, uh, I think it was like two weeks after the breakup. I had to come out to LA to film something. I had a half a day to look for a place. I went to the first place that I looked at. I looked at two places first place I did, that was terrible. It was all, and it was moldy and I'm like, Oh my God, universe, what are you telling me? And then I went to the second place and I loved it. And I signed the lease that day. I flew back to Raleigh, packed up, all my stuff sent all the boxes, overview ups, jumped on a plane to meet the boxes and come over. And within a couple of weeks I had moved and relocated to LA and it's been here ever since. And yeah,

Chase: 00:08:51 Amazing. You know, that kind of surprises me. Um, East coast and South the South, I'm originally from Virginia. I grew up, um, for the first 18 years of my life, pretty much on the Virginia, North Carolina border. Very, very small town, just growing up in the mountains and like the Southern charm, the Southern hospitality, all that stuff. It's wild for me to kind of hear that you didn't have that kind of community, I guess you weren't from there, right?

Jason: 00:09:17 Yeah. I wasn't from there. I was originally from, so I was born in North Miami beach and I moved when I was two, but not by myself. Like my mom moved with me because somebody got a $20 bill to my one's name was like, have at it. Uh, so I went from Miami to Orlando and then I was in Orlando for 30 something years. And so the reason for moving to Raleigh was that for anybody that's been to Orlando, it's has two seasons, right? It's hot and hot as hell. That's our two seasons and it's super flat. There's just like nothing there. So I'm like, I want some seasons. I want some elevation. And in my previous life, before I became an entrepreneur, I was in tech for 15 years. And a lot of that time, I did work in partnership with Cisco and Cisco, not the thong song, Cisco. So I could see definitely some silver hair and everything.

Jason: 00:10:01 Don't talk. You're welcome. So a copyright flat, I just realize it was two seconds. It was okay because a three second limit, it's all BS. So when I, when I was figuring like, I want to get out of Florida, I want to get elevation and seasons. Cisco has their second biggest office in Raleigh. So I had gone there a bunch. I'm like, let's just move to Raleigh. By that time I was an entrepreneur. I could kind of work from wherever. And so we picked up and moved there, but the thing is there, wasn't, there's a little more now there, wasn't a huge, like conscious community in Raleigh. There's there is much more now I give them a lot of credit. One of my buddies is actually here in LA right now for a couple of weeks, started a big part of the conscious movement there, which is great. But I think it was partly that, and it was partly that I just, like, I looked to my partner for everything. Like I made her my whole world. And it was also a great lesson for me in becoming single again, that like community's important, even when you have a dedicated partnership, romantic partnership community outside that relationship is still really important right now. It's ridiculous. That's a stretch, bro.

Chase: 00:10:56 That's a stretch of agreement. That's a stretch. I appreciate the velour approves. Um, yeah, let's go there. Community for me is absolutely huge. And that's something that, um, I have struggled with. Oh, struggle is the right word. It has been very, very important to me. Um, because of every time that I do have an established community, it's very well established. Yeah. My family growing up very tight knit, close, grew up with, you know, my grandparents on a bunch of land, you know, gardening just tribe. After that, I like 17, 18 left for the military. Six years of that. That's another tribe, tight knit tribe. After that moved back home, I'm back to my family again. Um, I go to school and so like every kind of community that I had, there was very little downtime. Even though there was transition, I went from one to another pretty quickly. And honestly, men moving here two years ago was the first time in 32 years at that point that I actually struggled to like plug and connect and community, a lot of abundance, a lot of opportunity, a lot of quote community here in LA, but finding the right one, I hate to say vetting, but kind of just like, you know, above, you know, beyond surface level kind of stuff. Um, did you struggle with that as well? What was your kind of community integration like going from East coast? West coast?

Jason: 00:12:12 Yeah. So for me, and this is something that I think I love that you said that because it makes me think of something that I've never really articulated before is that I know that feeling of like you want to plug in and it's, you know, there's already established communities and it's, it's hard sometimes to like break in, you know, like, you know, it's a very Drake, no new friends kind of thing happening sometimes in certain circles, especially as an adult, every time

Chase: 00:12:33 Like meeting new people and like, ah, are we becoming friends to have time for this? Like, there's a lot of, it's a big shift,

Jason: 00:12:39 Give candy to everybody. It's just like little kids, right. If you give, if you're a kid and you're like giving another kid M and M's, you're like best friends. It's like, why doesn't that work in the belt? So for me, like I said, I had a lot of, a lot of friends or I won't say a lot. I had a handful of people here that I really loved and trusted, but I had one person in particular, one of my best friends in the entire world who I f-ing loved beyond words, a woman called Ashley stall. I don't know if you know, Ashley

Chase: 00:13:01 Personally. Um, I think we're like, you're another degree of separation basically.

Jason: 00:13:05 Yeah. She's, she's amazing. And she was somebody who really quickly like plugged me in. She was like, everybody, you have to meet Jason. And she like brought me into the fold and I'm so grateful for it because I can, I can trace so many of the people that I'm friends with now to like initial connections that she had made. And so the reason I say, it's funny that you brought that up. And then I think about that now is that I, I try to do that now when I meet people who are new and I'm like, Oh, I'm going to pull you in, like, I'm going to introduce you to this community. I'm going to bring you to this gathering when we used to have gatherings and all that kind of stuff. So I think it's, I think it's really important that if you're, if you're not somebody who is already in a community, find somebody who's plugged in and who's willing and warm enough to invite you in. And if you are part of a community, become one of those people who brings people in, into the fold and has them really, like, I love one of my favorite things in the world is when I bring one person into another community and I can sell them to each other, like, Oh, you don't know chase, Oh my God, let me tell you all about this.

Chase: 00:13:56 You remove yourself from the equation. And she's like, yes, it's one of my favorite things in the world to do, man. Do you have kind of a process for, uh, I guess vetting again, you know, community, how do you kind of walk through the steps of, yes, this serves me in ways and I can serve the community because I feel those are kind of the two ways that reciprocity needs to happen to be an honest community, for one that you're actually going to value. What's your kind of your checks and balances with that?

Jason: 00:14:20 It's yeah. It's funny, man. Like for me, it's, um, it's, it's so much, and this is such an LA thing to say. It's such an energetic thing for me. Like I know as soon as I meet somebody, is it going to be hard to have a conversation with this person or easy to have a conversation with this person, content aside, context of conversation, isn't going to be easy? Is it, is it hard for me to carry this conversation? Am I constantly trying to figure out what I'm going to say next? Or does it flow? And I'm somebody who can typically keep conversation up pretty well. And if I meet somebody where it just isn't, I can't have that with them. It doesn't matter how much I could serve them or how much they could serve me. It's not going to work. And so for me, it's like, it's that ease? Like how quickly can I really be the silly, goofy, rap, loving spiritual, but still very pragmatic JG. The sooner I can do that, the more I know we're trying.

Chase: 00:15:08 Yeah. I'm sure you can hear it in my voice. You can hear it. And Jason's, we are loving live right now. We are dialed in and we're, we're a little stemmed out. Thanks to the help of a strong coffee. We're sipping on black today. Black by strong coffee company literally does everything you could want in a cup of coffee, clinically brewed ingredients to increase brain health and reduce cortisol, which is how that's something we call probably use more of this day and age dropping cortisol. We all need a little bit of cortisol throughout the day. It's a very, very important hormone. It serves a purpose. But look, when you get stressed out, when things are just go, go, go, go, go. And also when you add too much caffeine, like a lot of coffees have, then that spikes cortisol, and it's just really taxes your central nervous system.

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Chase: 00:19:34 Good for your body, man. Give your wallet really Shaun coffee company.com checkout code chase to say 15%. It seems like you know yourself pretty well. Most of the time. I mean, you clearly, I mean, I know just in the short time I got to know you, like, I know you've gone through a lie and you've gone through a lot of the work. I mean, you just, right now rattle off a lot of things that it seems you're pretty aware of what you contribute and also what, you know, you kind of how you can fill others cup other cups and how they can fill yours. How did you get to that point?

Jason: 00:20:07 Yeah. You know, this was actually a big thing for me. It started off as a business related kind of exploration for me, but then I realized that it has much further reaching implications and applications in business. And I remember when I, so, so just a little background professionally. So like I said, 15 years in tech, um, the majority of that in technology consulting when I was in Florida. And then when I left, uh, when I left corporate, I started up a transportation startup that was kind of, um, kind of like pre Uber. It was, uh, we, we created mobile executive offices. So we're going to have basically like a think of like a sprinter van with an office built in the back. And we could take people across the state of this is when I was in Florida. We would take people across the state that would be like a NetJets thing where they would like packages points. They look at $10,000 package and then people in their company could use it and we would deduct points. And that way they could actually bill people. So it was mainly for service professionals like lawyers and stuff. So

Speaker 6: 00:20:56 People were in transportation, they could work be it's making money as opposed to spending money

Jason: 00:21:01 Bill. So we had that and we had like the CEO of priceline.com on our advisory board. And it was something that I started doing when I was in grad school. It was a really cool thing. I did that. And then my second startup was in partnership with NASA and the space shuttle program. And we did some technology commercialization, dude. It was so freaking cool. I do, I know some spaceship on our team.

Speaker 6: 00:21:20 I was just how to get chase on a tangent talking about hard, man. I will tell him

Jason: 00:21:26 The picture of myself with a shuttle orbiter window, like from the shuttle with one of the NASA scientists and we're going over it because the technology that my company commercialized was from the shuttle program there, dude, you're out of this world. I also am a huge pun fan. I have a bad joke book on my counter. Uh, one of my favorite dad jokes in the world that I have to tell you right now is, uh, Hey chase, uh, I'm reading a book on anti-gravity, it's impossible to put down your welcome. I'm going to use that a hundred percent of your welcome I'm co-signing on that. So I did the NASA thing and, and through all of this is when I had started getting into personal growth and I was experienced transformation from, you know, being coached. I was 332 pounds at one point massively

Speaker 6: 00:22:11 Blown away, really

Jason: 00:22:13 Big. And I was big my whole life. Like I was, I was 250 pounds when I was 15, which is, kids are really loving and accepting. Okay.

Speaker 6: 00:22:20 Of course it had no problems whatsoever,

Jason: 00:22:24 Less romantic, but like to girls in high school, I was kind of like a Ken doll down here just like flat plastic. There was nothing really going on. Uh, so that was kind of a tough four years. So, so yeah, so I always, I struggle with all that stuff. And then I had massive stress and depression and anger and anxiety, just my whole life I'd had that stuff. And so in going through being coached and discovering personal growth and all this, I was having a lot of transformation and I really wanted to like turn around and do that for other people. Right? Like when you, when you go to a restaurant that's amazing, you can't help, but tell your friends about

Speaker 6: 00:22:54 It. You just can't can't shut up, shut up. I wish

Jason: 00:22:56 I'm sure it can be annoying sometimes, but so I knew, I knew I wanted to get into personal growth. So that's when I kind of started working in like coaching and speaking. And I started that in 2013 is when I got into this kind of form of the business. So all that to say back to me, knowing myself was that I was really trying to figure out how I was going to differentiate myself. Right. Because like, you know, everybody knows this, the market you've got to differentiate, you've got to stand out from the crowd. How do you do that? And the way I started doing it, when I started doing this business was that I was so intense. So obsessed with figuring out what I was going to be known for. Like, what's the thing I can hang my hat on, that nobody else has ever done.

Jason: 00:23:29 And that is a, a futile exercise in, but puckering stress and anxiety to figure out the thing that you're going to do that nobody's ever done before. Right. To be evolutionary. Yeah, exactly. Just to be like then the biggest thing ever. And so I would be there and I'm speaking and I'm creating different things and I'm coaching and doing these things. And I would get this reflection from people either after I did a keynote or they saw some video I posted or something and they would say, man, I don't know what it is about you. Like when I watch you, I just feel more joyful. I feel more playful. And I'm like, yeah, yeah. But tell me about how smart I am. Like the thing I just shared, tell me why that's like changing. And I kept pushing it away. And it wasn't until 20, uh, 2017.

Jason: 00:24:10 When my book came out, one person where it came out, I was doing a press tour. And my very last interview was a good day Sacramento morning show. And, uh, and it was great. And the anchor there got in Cody stark. Super cool, no relation to Tony stark, no relation whatsoever. I tried, uh, he was so cool. He had prepped, he had read the book and stuff and he interviewed me. And at the end of the interview, when they were like taking the mic off me and everything, and he says, Jason, I don't know what it is about you, man. I just feel so much joy when I'm around you, the guests in the green room set it, our people said it, the co-host said it. Like everybody said it. And for some reason that day, it really keyed into me. I'm like, Oh , that's my thing.

Jason: 00:24:46 And I realized it wasn't about figuring out what I was going to be known for. It was about figuring out what I was going to be known for activating in other people. What could I activate in other people? What feeling or sense could I activate? What could I give them permission to feel? And when I started really getting that like, Oh dude, that's your thing. Then that becomes the butter in the pan. For me, no matter what I create, whether it's in work stuff or in friendships or whatever, if I lead with knowing who I am that naturally when I don't try, I tend to activate that for people and the rest takes care of it.

Chase: 00:25:17 You're the plug man. You're, you're the catalyst really

Jason: 00:25:21 Young, really young. A

Chase: 00:25:23 Couple of things came up right there. And um, we're really trying not to forget this stuff. Luckily that that's true. I feel that strong coffee right now. Like, I'm just like, I'm about to dial into a matrix any second now. Um, when you were talking about like, what am I going to be known for? Yeah. Immediately the question came up for me was, is it ego or legacy? Would you say? W how would you define those two? And how would you kind of define them in that particular?

Jason: 00:25:46 Such a good question. So, so here's the thing. I am one of the people who will tell you ego is not a bad thing. I agree. Yeah. Cause to me, ego drives my service because for me to say it doesn't feel really good for me to do a Facebook live where people say, Oh my God, I needed to hear that. That insight is going to change everything for me, I'd be lying. And there are some people like, Nope, I, I deflect that. It's not about me. It's about you fine. And it makes me feel really good when that happens. So if that drives me to do more of that stuff, great legacy is is, is a different, is a different story. I have crap though. Even if you get outside, I think about this though. It still has to come partly from ego. I'm just thinking about, for me, it's tricky.

Chase: 00:26:28 I, I do think I don't. I was just asking that question. That's what popped up. I don't know if there is a strong differentiation. I don't even know if I would say that you can have one without the other. They both probably need a little bit of both, but yeah, just when you said, I was like, I guess really the question was, what was the driving force? Was it because of ego? Was it because of legacy?

Jason: 00:26:50 I think if, if we're, if we can equate, if we can put what I'm about to say under the umbrella of ego, I think it's ego because I think it fits better in that one legacy is the deep seated need to feel enough, right? So, you know, growing up, being raised by a single mother, my dad left my mom when she was pregnant. Never seen him walk by me on the street. Wouldn't even never met. Your father, never met him. Never seen the picture of him, no clue who this man is. He literally could be anywhere around us right now. It could be nuncio. It could be my father, but I'm disinfecting.

Chase: 00:27:22 I brought you here to take, to, to tell you something, actually where's Mori Bumble it, please.

Jason: 00:27:29 But, but I really think that like, because of that, and it's something that, you know, it's, everybody has their own version of feeling, not enough or whatever. We all have it in some part of our lives. So I'm not special. But I think for me, you know, growing up and, and being, uh, having all this, this stress and this anger and depression and being so overweight, there were two things I developed really early on as coping mechanisms. Okay. One was humor because if I can make people laugh, then I can, at least not like I can deflect. I won't get picked on as much. Or if I'm laughing at myself, then obviously it's harder for them to laugh at me. But also it, it feels like there was a sense of validation approval. The second one was empathy because since I didn't get the romantic interest of women, I would listen to their problems, women, girls, right?

Jason: 00:28:12 Cause in high school, I would listen to their problems in a way that none of the other guys would. And so I would still get the connection, at least part of the connection. I was looking for a lot of the connections, a huge amount of the connection. And so I developed those things as coping mechanisms. And funny enough, those are the driving forces of how I serve in the world now. Right. Everything is a shadow and a gift side to it. Right. So, so I think for me, it was ego in that I really want it to feel enough. And I feel like now that shadow of needing to feel enough is what I've channeled into being of service and making it.

Chase: 00:28:40 I love that, man. I love that. Um, the second thing that came to mind when you're talking about your story was, um, I always say, and this is in a past life. I was, I was just health coach chase. Uh, that's what I did. I lived in the health, fitness, wellness world. And for me, I worked for many years in a clinical environment and it was working with obese, morbidly, obese people, um, pre-existing conditions, comorbidities, things like that. And it was always like, it was the weight loss. It was the fitness, it was the nutrition, all of those external things that needed to happen, like literally needed to happen for these people's lives. But then that was just, it was what needed to happen before the thing that really needed to happen. It was fitness was a gateway drug. Uh, the weight loss was a gateway drug. It was just the starting point to true transformation, to true personal development to really learning about the human potential. Uh, would you say, would that, was that true for you? Was it as the weight began to come off and I'm curious, how did you do that? And then what else happened after that, man? Yeah, it was, it was a both.

Jason: 00:29:42 And for me, because what I realized was, um, I was, I was carrying around the physical weight, which was easy to see cause I was 330 pounds, but what I didn't realize was how much emotional weight I was carrying around and how much mental weight I was carrying around. And, and that all those forms of, of weight, w E I G H T weights, uh, were causing me to weight wit to get out in the world and do things right. And then it was this weird cycle. Like the longer I waited, the heavier, I felt right. And it's just like this, this self-propagating cycle of like, you're still not doing the thing. You're still not being who you want to be. You're still not putting yourself out in the world the way you want to. And then that makes it even easier to keep eating the crap that I'm not supposed to eat and not just the self, the cell probably getting loop.

Jason: 00:30:20 So I had tried everything you could think of. Luckily, I had actually had the same family doctor from the time I was 15 until the time I was in my early thirties. So they had documented all the things I had tried had to have been so helpful. It was super helpful. And I mean, I had like sugar busters and weight and South beach and all these different things. And I don't know why it wasn't working, but my, my sense is that there was a, uh, partially there was a pragmatic part that I still wasn't eating or moving the way I needed to. But part of it, I think was a, a mental block. Like I needed to create that space, uh, of having a larger body so that maybe I had protection from, from things outside of me, you know, I'm not going to let anybody leave me again.

Jason: 00:30:58 Like dad did. So I'll create this buffer of protection in the form of a larger physical body. So I think that there's, it'd be, it'd be ridiculous to think there wasn't something linked there, but ultimately what happened was after all of this trying and all of this, it was just gotten so bad. 332 pounds. My, I think my BMI at this point was 41, uh, really, really high. And so I ended up having bariatric surgery in 2011. I had the gastric sleeve and this is something I didn't use to want to talk about because there's still a stigma that, that means like you took the easy way out, right? Like you just, you went in for a surgery and then the weight just pours off and you're good to go. And I had to go through a year of preparation and have the surgery, including psychological evaluations and a lot of other things to even have the surgery.

Jason: 00:31:40 And then the work started. I'm not going to lie having the surgery first 40 pounds or so came off fairly easy. I didn't, I mean, I wasn't really eating at all. I didn't have any solid foods for a month from the surgery. I was pretty much all clear liquids and like baby food kind of stuff for a month. But after that, like the first 30, 40 pounds were good, the other 80, 90 pounds that I lost, I had to work. I had to change my relationship to food, to movement, to all these things. And I'm nine years out. I mean, you can gain all the way back.

Chase: 00:32:06 Yeah, for sure. Do you know any significant weight loss after five years? It's either come back?

Jason: 00:32:11 Not even more. Exactly. And so, so it's been my work to keep this off over the years, the last nine years. And like I said, it was something that I used to not talk about because of the stigma, but I don't really give a what people think about any more, because I know the work I had to put in and I know that the, the mental shifts I had to go through as a part of that are actually much bigger than the physical stuff that I went through.

Chase: 00:32:31 How so? Um, because it all takes work. Right. But it's different kinds of work. How would you kind of, um, quantify the work for the physical self or the physical way? The emotional way, the spiritual weight, all the things that come with

Jason: 00:32:47 Weight loss. Yeah, for me, it's a, I don't know if you've ever experienced this. It's funny. People think if you're like a coach and you're in personal growth, you have your all figured out. You never struggle. And I'm like, I, it puts me even more in the process cause I'm like exposed to it constantly. I'm hyper observant. I'm hyper vigilant about like my mindset and everything else. So I probably see things that I need to change in my mindset that aren't actually there, but I still try to focus on them. And so the reason it's, it's even more challenging sometimes is that it can feel if you have a bad day, right. A bad day, something happens. Something knocks you off your game. It can feel these for me. I won't speak for anybody else ever in my experience, it can feel like, Oh my God, this has all been a fluke. I didn't actually transform. I've been fooling myself all these times. I have one day of anger, right? Like I have an angry outburst, like, Oh my God, you're that guy again. When you were a teen who was punching holes in walls and chasing people in traffic, like that's who you really are, that is debilitating to your soul. If you don't know how to navigate that,

Chase: 00:33:47 You lost your right to be human. You know, like I'm not allowed to have these mess ups because I've learned a, B and C.

Jason: 00:33:53 Exactly. Especially, especially when you're the guy who activates joy and playfulness. Right. So that can be a kind of a double-edged sword. There's a guy. Do you know a guy called Adam ROA? Are you familiar with that umbrella? He has a really popular, uh, he's a post spoken word poet guy. He's like a gold cast video has like 200 million users. Really beautiful. Yeah. It's really beautiful poem that he did. Uh, and, uh, and I remember we met, uh, so I said, I do some work with this company, mind Valley. And if you don't mind Valley. So I host their event called [inaudible] and Adam came and spoke at I one of the AFS in Portugal last year. And afterwards we were just messaging on WhatsApp afterwards. And he's like, Hey, I really want to honor you for how much joy and like play and humor and stuff that you bring to your work and how much of a burden.

Jason: 00:34:36 I bet that as sometimes, Whoa, no way. And he like that hit me right in the heart. Like I felt so seen that I was like, you know, sometimes it can be. And so the reason I say that is that like, I want us to be able to talk about that stuff. I want it to be okay, that I'm the joy in play guy. And I still deal with . I still have my down days because I do right. This is like, if you had an entire history, like I do from a very young age of being like a teenager in extreme depression, the goal for me of personal growth is not immunity to stress, anxiety, depression, and anger. It's navigation of those things. It's closing the window of time from the time you get triggered. And the thing happens to when you get back to a place of peace and equanimity that's success, that's transformation to me. So, but when I have moments where I don't realize that, then it's like, Oh no, you're undoing all your progress. Whereas if you gain a half a pound, you're like, okay, cool. Well then no more processed foods tomorrow and it'll come back off. Right. So to me, that was why it was a bigger deal for the inner work than the outer work.

Chase: 00:35:34 Honestly, man, that, that was very true, very spot on for, um, I, uh, shout out to a special person here in the audience a little bit. Uh, it's kinda just triggering some past memories and the seasons of life really. That's really what I thought. Um, through my physical years, uh, growing up a young man being in the military and then getting out, um, long story short, I, I learned how to walk again twice. I had to go through a lot of injury. I went through a lot of injuries in the military and so, uh, the physical self became my mission. Um, and then when I got out, that's why I got into what I did was because it was so important for me to reestablish that norm that I studied it and then worked in it. Um, but like the physical self was, I thought that was it.

Chase: 00:36:17 I thought I was like, I figured out fitness. I got fit. Like, that's it, I'm done. Um, but no, it's not. It's, it's, it's a realization that you don't get immunity. Like you said, you just, you finally get all the tools that you need in your toolbox to maintain. And then every day it's just like fine tuning, fine tuning. And then same thing with personal development once I'm kind of like life happened and I really stepped into new career, new relationships and, you know, separated military chase. It was like, there's a lot of other emotional stuff. There's a lot of personal development. I began to listen to one podcast and became enlightened kind of thing. Um, and it was like, wow, like you think like, it's you think you read these things, hear these things like, okay, cool. Like I can solve that problem now it's done. No, it's it's, it is kind of that double-edged sword. It's that burden and the gift at the same time, it's the gift of knowing that I'm not alone, that there are ways to work through this stuff. And I don't ha I, I can feel better. I can do better do more, but it's not, uh, like, uh, a solution to everything,

Jason: 00:37:15 Right? Yeah. It's a day by day, moment by moment practice. And that is where people I think get most tripped up totally. And, and, and beating themselves up about it because this is the thing, right? Like personal growth is no different than, uh, Michael Jordan practicing his jump shot. He never got to a point where he was like, you know what? I got this, just call me when the game starts. It's a constant thing. Right. And I remember actually I was talking to somebody about this and I, I know nothing about sports. So when I use sports metaphors, like I want some golf class because I get the big

Chase: 00:37:42 Sports. I don't know, man, I'm pretty sure the Lakers are going to the super bowl this year. That's what I, I,

Jason: 00:37:48 It might be, but it depends if their blades have been sharpened enough to get on there, they got a hat trick last time. See, I didn't even know about that.

Chase: 00:37:55 Johnson got a, um, home run and it was sealed the deal

Jason: 00:37:59 Before or after he won the Kentucky Derby was that,

Chase: 00:38:02 Well, I mean, he was, he was already bogging the whole time. So I love to people who don't do sports.

Jason: 00:38:07 We know a lot about sports, but I was talking to a buddy about this, and this is a buddy who like played college basketball and like he's really into sports. And he was talking about how we were, we were talking about mastery, just like, you know, the process of mastery, which I just, I love mastery as, as, as a process, it's not a destination. Self-mastery self-mastery mastery of anything really. Okay. So you look at, uh, LeBron James, who, it would be fair to say as a master or has mastery level, even sports. And I know he's killing it with his hairline. You still know. Right. So, so the, the thing he was saying was, you know, if you at LeBron, James dribbling, dribbling is when they hit the ball and bounce it, not like out of the mouth. So when you look at LeBron, James dribbling, you can't tell if he's left-handed or right-handed because he's putting so much time, you can't tell.

Jason: 00:38:46 Right. And so that, that was kind of like a lesson in mastery and we're sitting there talking, and then somebody else says something in the conversation about kind of what we're saying. Like, do you guys ever get upset that like, you feel like you've mastered something like emotionally mindset wise, and then you get like hit by it again, and it like knocks you off your game. And I was like, yeah. And then I was thinking about the mastery thing. And I said, you know what, actually, the LeBron thing is, is, is a really, really good thing to think about. And I'm like, what do you mean? I said, well, listen, if LeBron James had practiced his entire life, right. Basketball, his entire life in Ohio, which is at C-level, let's say right. And he and his stamina was up and he could play the full game.

Jason: 00:39:21 And he could just like left and right. Nobody knows like what, you know what his thing is, he just a master. And then for the first time ever, he goes to Denver, Colorado to play. And now the elevation is different. And the way he processes auction is different. He's going to be like, what the hell? I've been practicing this for all these years? Why is it hard for me to run down the court? And it's like, every time you go to a new level of anything, but a new level of mastery in your life, you're going to be presented with things like this. If you're really going to step into your next level of self-leadership, if you're at a different elevation. So it's only to be expected that these things are going to come back up. The difference is like, if you're playing a video game and you come around a corner and you get killed, you remember now

Speaker 7: 00:39:56 What's around that. So you're a little better prepared

Jason: 00:39:58 To face it. And to me, if you're a little better prepared to face it, if you know how the system works, that's the biggest problem, dude, is when we don't understand how the system works, we think a thing happens. And then we have the event happens. And then we have a feeling when we don't know that there's a thought that happens in between the event and the feeling, no matter what we're doing, we're trying to mold and modify and manipulate all the events in our lives. Life never seems to work, but as soon as we know how the system works, now, we're at least a little more equipped to say, Oh, this is what I call having a Brittany Spears moment. I thought pops in my head. I take it seriously. And I go, oops, I did it again. Like I let a thought take over what's going on in my world. So it's so important to learn how the system works. So you have a fighting chance to actually feel

Speaker 7: 00:40:36 Flourish. I actually had a Britney Spears moment over quarantine. I shaved my head, Oh my God, did you beat up a van with that umbrella too? I didn't go that far. Uh, but I, uh, I just like, yeah, it. I just bless my head. Oh yeah. I got to see pictures of that. You could pull it off. It wasn't that bad. I thought it worked out better because actually I shaved my head, but I grew up my beard. So it was like a good contrast. I guess they pulled it through, pulled the hair. Um, all this stuff is this, is this kind of like the meat of the book prison break? Is that, is that the inspiration? Is that the theme? Is that, is that the work? Is that the expectation here it is, man.

Jason: 00:41:11 I just there's. There's just so it's so easy to be a prisoner of circumstance to be at the whim of who's in the wild white house. What's going on in the economy, the song on the radio that reminds you of your ex. It's so easy to live in that circumstance and I've done it my entire life. And there are still a moment that I do it. What I want to show people in the book is that there is, there's a different option moment. By moment. It's not good, bad, right or wrong. So you're not bad or wrong. If you have a prisoner moment, the key is to recognize that we are creating our reality, right? Because at least when we know that we could say, and there are plenty of times where I have prisoner moments, but I say to myself, I'm choosing this. I'm deciding right now, I'm going to be a prisoner.

Jason: 00:41:46 That's okay. That's a win. Like to know that it's not the thing out there that it's just, you, that's still a win. Because once we have that awareness, there's this great quote by a guy called Nathaniel Branden who's since passed away. But he was a psychotherapist. He says, you can't leave a place. You've never been right. You can't leave a place. You've never been. So if I start having the realization like, Oh, I'm really angry and really upset right now. But it's, I'm creating this in this moment. I've now seen the place where I'm at. I now have a baseline to say, cool, does this serve me? Is this the way I want to show up? How would I actually like to feel right. Given, given the conditions of the game that I'm playing with right now, what would I like to create? Like using the language of intention, right?

Jason: 00:42:24 Like what would I love to create? So for me, and that kind of whole premise of the book is when we, when we make, when we don't make our thoughts so significant, right? Well, we don't take everything so seriously, it's much easier to navigate things. And, and that is my, my practice constantly is trying to say to myself, number one, stop beating yourself up. You're having a human experience. It's okay. And to use the tools that allow me to kind of break out of the self-imposed prison that I put myself in, I'm in a, I'm in a prison, uh, where I am both the captive and the cap tour. Right? Like I, I own all of that. So the more I can be playful with my thoughts and not take them too seriously, the less they have any effect on me. So one of, one of my mantras, for example, that I, that I love, and I try to practice as much as possible is present, but irrelevant, present, but irrelevant.

Jason: 00:43:10 What do you mean by that? So what that means is if I'm driving in my car, right, I'm literally driving down the road in my car and let's say, let's say, you're sitting next to me in the car chase. And you were having just a terrible day, you're angry or you're depressed, or you're sad, or you're all three, you got the hat trick, right? You got the hat trick. And so you're sitting in the car next to me. The interesting thing about that is that you being in that state, in the passenger seat next to me does not change the way the car operates. Yeah. Steering wheel still operates the same gas and brake pedal all operate the same you're present, but you're irrelevant to my experience of actually operating the vehicle. Okay. So the more I can notice my thoughts and say, there's a stressful thought present, but irrelevant. I acknowledge you. I'm not trying to get you to go away. I don't want anybody to hear this and say, okay, well, how do I reframe? How do I,

Speaker 7: 00:43:55 It's not stuffing it down. It's not ignoring it.

Jason: 00:43:58 It's none of that stuff. It's understanding that it's okay. You can welcome it in. You literally can welcome it in and say stress. I see you depressive thought, I see you anxiety, ICU. And you don't have to be relevant to my experience. You can come along for the ride. You can sit here as long as you want. I'm not trying to even get rid of you. A lot of times when we think about like sadness or, or kind of heavy emotions, we think about getting rid of them. What if we said, instead, you can stay here as long as you want. Yeah. And happiness. When happiness comes, what if we said you don't have to stay? You guys are all cool to come and be transient as you want to. Yeah.

Speaker 7: 00:44:28 That's so huge. Uh, I feel like I'm in a therapy session. Uh,

Jason: 00:44:32 Well, first you had a psychic session now sleep any game.

Chase: 00:44:36 This is why I'm just so grateful for what I do. Like thank you for this conversation, man. Um, I lost my dad at 19, uh, to a terminal illness. And it was right. Like the show's about you. I promise. I keep telling my story too. I love your story, but it's connection. Um, and so at 19, I was about a year into my military career, becoming a young man, anybody at that age, uh, you're stepping into your own. And during that time, I always use the excuse of like, I don't have the luxury of feeling that right now I had about 30 days of emergency leave, got to go home, very my father be with my family. And then I had to go back to being a soldier. And I always said that I didn't have the luxury. I couldn't, I couldn't afford to be sad.

Chase: 00:45:20 I didn't have the ability to be depressed or to grieve and go through that. Um, I had this high, I had a very, very demanding job and, um, and it messed me up. That was an excuse I absolutely could have and should have. And the number one piece of advice, I would always go back and give myself as like chase. It's okay. To feel. It's okay to feel that. Yes. Um, and you should, I always had this kind of idea that if you're happy, if you're outgoing, if you're doing all these, like these, you know, things that are good in norm, like it's good, those are allowed to happen. But anything other than that can't but no, man only please like, talk to me, talk to 19 year old, chase, talk to people who are stuck there of like, why don't we allow ourselves to feel those things and how important it is. Uh, I had this analogy of ever watched Dexter. I say like your dark passenger, and we all have this dark passenger or dark passengers that we don't need to get rid of them. In fact, they're, they're, they're not driving the ship. They're not driving the car, but like, we need to learn to be present with them because they do have a lesson.

Jason: 00:46:21 Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And, and I love the show. I thank you for sharing that story. And uh, it's I think it's, I think it's well-meaning and I think actually that the reason I think it's hard for us to feel these things sometimes or think that we're not supposed to feel them. Yeah. Even more so that's the thing is like, that's why permission is such a big deal. Like I actually say, and a lot of, a lot of coaches and, and personal growth people, don't like, when I say this, but I say that as, as coaches or people in this field, we're in the PR business, but PR stands for permission and reminders. Okay. There's nothing super brand new that any of us are saying, people out there need permit and you hear people say, Oh, I really needed to hear this today. Or thanks for the reminder. Like, you know, you have innate wisdom that tells you it's okay to feel where I think a lot of this comes from, and I don't think this is talked about enough. I think we're a lot of this comes from is that the people in our lives growing up could not hold space for those emotions a hundred percent. Right. You're a kid and you're crying. Oh honey. No, it's okay. Don't cry. Nope. Why, why shouldn't I cry? That's because your parent was just like, just please just shut off.

Jason: 00:47:21 Well, intentioned. They're not, they're not bad. They're not trying to, you know, emotionally stunned us, but everywhere you go, you know, people, they they'd even done like kind of studies this as well. Like when somebody is crying, don't hand them a tissue because you're essentially saying you need to get rid of your tears. Right? Wow. So it's like, we're, we're judging these emotions. And, and if people are not comfortable holding space for your emotions and we have this tribe mentality of wanting to be accepted and approved of, then we better stuff that down because we don't want to chase people away or make them uncomfortable. Right. So that's why I think it's so important, especially, especially for men. And this is not just men, but especially for men, is to be able to hold space for that. Not just for our, our female, the females in our lives, but the males in our lives as well.

Jason: 00:48:01 Because I think there is so much mental health that could be a mental health challenges that could be dealt with. If we just knew there were people in our lives that we could fall apart in front of. Yes, yes, yes, absolutely. Look at people like I remember when it was like one week where Anthony Bourdain and Kate spade, both committed suicide. And I, I'm not a suicide expert and I obviously don't know anything about their lives, but something inside me intuitively said, if they had somebody, they could completely fall to pieces in front of, without any worry that it was gonna get leaked to the press or anything else that they had someone they could totally fall apart in front of. They'd still be here today and whether or not I'm right. I believe that for myself, that if I don't have somebody to, to completely let myself go in front of and know that I'll be loved and not judged, then I would go nuts. You can't hurt.

Chase: 00:48:45 It really wouldn't have hurt for them. Absolutely

Jason: 00:48:47 Wouldn't have hurt. So I think that's probably why we get this, these, these messages that we're not supposed to feel these things, or it's not okay to think about feeling these things just because people can't hold that space. So I really want people to understand, like, you know, if you walk up to somebody on the street right now and you say like, Hey, can I touch your hand? Which right now they'd probably run away from you. But if you like, just play, if you say like, Hey, can I touch your hand? And they say, yeah. And you say, okay, put your hand up. And then you take your hand and you put it against their hand and you press they'll press back without you saying anything right. Immediately. It's try it with anybody without telling them nobody lets their hand, just go back. As soon as you press like what's what's going on there.

Jason: 00:49:19 The same thing happens with our emotions. As soon as we try to push them away, they go, I'm not going anywhere. I deserve to be here and they push back. So as long as we keep resisting these things and thinking they're bad emotions and don't realize they are part of the total experience of being a human, that we can't feel moments of being godlike. And like we're the greatest things ever, unless we can also know feeling like worthless pieces of . And that's just the dichotomy of being a human until we can integrate that. We're always going to say that's bad and happy is good. And we don't, I don't want to judge my life that way. Yeah.

Chase: 00:49:49 So true man. Um, amazing explanation. Thank you. Uh, I'll only add to that, that a lesson that I've kind of picked up on over the years is that the more that I can get away from defining things as good or bad, I've had revelations, um, good and bad feelings, good and bad days, good in bed, uh, business, good and bad. You know, dog walks the more that I can get away from good and bad. And I attribute a lot of this to, um, every day I start my day off with a stoic philosophy. Uh, it's been amazing. Uh, and so the more I can kind of separate that. And again, it's a practice. It's not like I read a stoic book and like we're earlier, you know, it fitness and done. Um, no, it it's a realization that the more that I can separate good and bad and just things, things happen, things are we then get the option.

Chase: 00:50:40 We get the ability to attach reason and meaning to them. And so, and I think that's transformational. I really do hope that that continues to be a part of my practice. Um, so that not only from my development, but especially like children, like I don't want to pass off those expectations. I, I do. I credit my upbringing, uh, raise a lot by my grandparents, my family, very again, tribe. And I feel like I've been set up for success in a lot of ways for parenting, but at the same time, like, yeah, they don't show your emotions like suppress it down. Like, uh, so I, I really hope that I can carry on that skillset. And you will your work for sure. I mean, it is a big part of that and it's definitely going to help a lot of people. So thank you for that.

Jason: 00:51:21 I'm trying, man. I'm, I'm in the same boat, man. I'm trying to live my message. And this is, you know, this is my, my whole thing is I want to wake up every day. And I was just talking to one of my clients about this, that last week as a coach and, and was having like a down day or a down week. And he's like, well then who the hell might it be coaching him? I can't figure this stuff out for myself. And, and I told him what I'll tell you. And I think it applies whether you're a coach or not, is that your only responsibility is to wake up every day and live in the direction of that thing. Right? So if you know that living a happy life, it means you go West. Then some days I'm going to take one step in the direction of West.

Jason: 00:51:54 Sometimes I'm going to get two miles in the direction of West. Sometimes I'm going to go a half a mile and then go back a quarter mile. But I still know that I'm living in the direction of West. If I can wake up everyday and live in the direction of what I know to be true, what brings me peace and ease, because that is really the thing I'm trying to make the center of my universe. When I get anxious, I know a thousand percent it's because I'm making something external the center of my universe. Any days that I make my business's center of my universe, I'm anxious. Anytime I make finding a romantic partner, the center of my universe, I'm anxious. Anytime I make anything, the center of my universe, I'm anxious. Why? Because if something's a center of your universe, then all you're trying to do is protect it from failing and falling apart. And that's not a way to

Chase: 00:52:33 Live, make everything revolve around it. And

Jason: 00:52:35 Then how can you possibly live life when you're so deep in the thing? So my practice has been really starting to shift that the only thing I will make the center of my universe is my own experience of peace and ease. Okay. Right. So when I start getting really stressed out, I want to ask myself the question whenever I can, this is not something I do a hundred percent of the time. It's the thing I do all the time. Except the times I don't is to ask myself, okay, in this moment, am I making my peace and ease a priority, really slowing down for a minute. It's okay. I'm mad. I'm mad about this. The team member did this, the client didn't sign up. This person's complaining fine in this moment. Am I making my own peace and ease my priority? And if I'm not, that's for me to slow down, get really, really present and ask myself what would make that a priority again in this moment.

Chase: 00:53:19 That's a great recentering question. Great anchoring on, I would challenge the person listening to create your own of that. Um, I had a client last year and one of my coaching programs who, um, like were struggling to kind of, it wasn't so much like, what am I working on? What am I moving towards? What am I moving forward with? It was, I just feel like in order for me to really do that, I have to kind of like, I need to be attached to something. I need to have it. I need to attach a meaning. Like I need a tether. Uh, so we literally, I guess you'd call it like a little totem we got on this slide was like, uh, I think he put it on a necklace or bracelet. It was just this small little thing. I believe it was a, uh, like a fly fishing lure from his grandfather.

Chase: 00:53:58 That's why his most formative memories were with his grandfather on these trips. And what he was doing was trying to build this new community for, for brotherhood, for familyhood, for fatherhood. And he's like, I just like, I'm having, I'm struggling kind of like convey this as like, um, I feel like it's about me, you know, how do I kind of bring up this, this lesson that was so important to me that has helped my life so much and kind of bring that into the path for what I'm creating. And it was just a small little tether, so it can literally be a tangible thing. It can be a question like you just posed. Uh, for me, it's remembering just to like, literally pause, take a breath. And like breath has been so transformational because it separates, everything kind of reminds you of what's important and what's not. Do you do like

Speaker 7: 00:54:38 Breath work stuff like actual, I

Chase: 00:54:41 Went through to 2019. I did two guided, uh, breath work sessions. Um, first one was really wild. Uh,

Speaker 7: 00:54:50 Oh, the Tropic breathing. Did you have like fall hands and stuff? Yeah. Samantha Skelly. I do. Yeah. She, it was, she led the session. No way. That's actually stalls best friend. Yeah, yeah,

Chase: 00:54:59 Yeah, of course. Yeah. Samantha, um, and quick tangent with that one. Does she did the great explanation of a here's physiologically, probably what you're going to feel. You may feel something may, you may not. Um, you know, I kind of had like, you know, the tingling that was getting the lofts of Claus, you know, you get hypoxia a little bit super oxygenated blood, and then all of a sudden, dude, I , you not, I was in my father, his last dying breaths in the hospital bed. I was an exact replica because I was there, my stepmom, my sister, uh, our family friend, one of my best friend's sisters. And then me, I was in my father in his eyes staring at me in the window. And I always struggle with like his, he had ALS so for a long time, he couldn't talk and walk in. So I never got closure. You know, he's never like, you know, chase goodbye. I couldn't say goodbye. And in his voice, like I was in him looking through his eyes at me in his voice, he was like, chase is okay out of nowhere, man. I was just

Speaker 7: 00:55:58 Like, freaking out do my lots of clothes on the floor. And then all of a sudden I was

Chase: 00:56:02 Transplanted back in there. Like, what the hell is that about? Um, that was amazing. The human body continues to blow my mind. And that was just through hyper breathing man.

Speaker 7: 00:56:12 Incredible. I feel like that message is trying to get to you all along. And that was the moment you were receptive to hear it. And I finally paused when I finally took a breath. A lot of breasts actually. Yeah. It was pretty wild. That's God, the power, that's the

Jason: 00:56:24 Power of breathing and that's America. What did it? I can't even like, I'm just feeling that experience.

Chase: 00:56:28 It was insane. Wow. The second one, um, immediately I got an answer to a business decision that I was mulling over. It was like clear as day. It was like, yes. And, uh, so it wasn't like as emotionally intense, I guess, but um, yeah. Breath work. No, that's man. That's insane. Yeah. Like what's going on with his two nostrils.

Jason: 00:56:45 Oh man. Wow. Yeah, I haven't done any holotropic breathing in a while, man. I should have,

Chase: 00:56:49 It was good. Really good. Yeah. To

Jason: 00:56:51 Experience her work. And she's amazing at that stuff.

Chase: 00:56:54 Um, kind of shifting gears a little bit, man. I know this is a big part of the work that you do, like for your own self and your content, but this is also what you help facilitate for other coaches, right? Yeah. So, I mean, that's gotta be a whole other level. I mean I've coached clients and I've coached coaches. Uh, you have to really kind of shift your, your approach. You have to wear a different teacher hat, um, because you're no longer just starting giving, helping someone build fundamentals, you know, usually they're already, you know, Hey, I've already kind of gone a few steps. You know, I got this kind of strong foundation. What's your experience like working, coaching other coaches, honestly, man, like this day and age, every, every gram, every gram, everybody on Instagram as a coach, like, you know, how are you different? Why are you different? And like, you know, what w what end result are you hoping to kind of pass off to these other people that you're working with?

Jason: 00:57:41 Yeah, dude, it's so funny. So, uh, so I, I have a one-line business plan. Uh it's it's and, and I'm going to tell you upfront, this is something I want everybody listening to steal like an artist and make their own, uh, because I think everybody can have this one line business plan for themselves in their own way. And my one-line business plan is to leave everybody I meet with at least 5% more joy than I found them. Okay, that's my business plan. Now that's the front-facing one. If I was being truthful, really truthful, my actual one-line business plan would be to leave everybody I meet with at least 5% less suffering than when I found that. Right. I don't want to skew negative by putting it out there, but that's really what it is. So for me, kind of back to the known for versus known for activating, I know that my role on this planet is to help reduce or eliminate suffering from people's lives, or at least facilitate that happening.

Jason: 00:58:28 I'm not going to be egoic enough to think that I can remove it for them, but help the people on the path to that. Exactly. Right. Exactly. And so the current iteration of that is helping coaches build their businesses. But the funny thing about it is that there's a lot of coaches out there that help people build their businesses. And, and a lot of them do really great work and it's very strategic and practical and all that stuff is great. And then we do a lot of that as well. And I know that the deep transformational work is actually what holds people back, because as much as people would love to say like, but my system for coaching will get you all the most clients and dah, dah, dah, dah. The fact of the matter is this, they did, there was a Netflix documentary about diets and they went through all the different diets, South beach, Mediterranean, all these different things.

Jason: 00:59:05 And you know, which one was the most effective diet that they found at the end. It's the one you'll stick with. Right? And so the same thing happens here. All the different systems for building your business. If you stick with any one of them, they're probably going to work. The Quito is to find the one that's in alignment with you. And in order for you to find them, what's in alignment for you, you know, how you right? And so what we do that I think is different is we focus so much on the human. We don't want you to just go be mini JGs. We don't want you to do any of that stuff. I want you to do my thing and your way, and I think is intimacy and connection and really providing value. But I want you to find the way to do that in your own way. And I want you to bring out your humanity, your quirks, your personality, what really makes you you, because I really believe that in most businesses, nowadays, probably all businesses, but especially in coaching, it's 90% who you are and 10% what you teach

Chase: 00:59:50 A hundred percent, a hundred percent of that 90

Speaker 7: 00:59:54 It's a good math equate, 60% of the time. It works every time, every time.

Jason: 00:59:58 Amazing. So, so that that's really, the thing is like, is, is, and it goes back to the known for versus non for activating. And the thing is, is like, if you look at churches, I'm sure in Virginia, there's a lot of churches. I grew up Southern Baptist. Yeah, there you go. Right. So there would be, at least in Florida and also North Carolina, there would be street corners where on opposite corners, they would be two churches that are both the same exact denomination. And there are certain people that will only go to church one and certain people that will only go to church too, but they literally have the same content. They have the same book,

Speaker 7: 01:00:29 The same, the same curriculum yet the same textbooks.

Jason: 01:00:31 People go, all the people go to one or go to the other. It's because of the person delivering it, they're bringing their story. It's the way they're showing up in the world. And it's like, there's something about that person, our empathy receptors and our mirror neurons go crazy and say, there's something about that person. I want more of them in my life. That's what I believe helps you build your coaching business is really having people see like, Oh, this human, this humans like me, because that happens as soon as we meet somebody. And this goes back to the community thing from before, right. As soon as I meet somebody, our empathy receptors say, are you like me? Or not like me? If you're like me, I want to get closer. If you're not like me, I'm going to run away as quickly as possible because it can be a threat. You could be a threat. Same thing happens in business. Business is an empathy game first and

Chase: 01:01:10 A hundred percent agree and I'll give away kinda some secret sauce. Um, this podcast has been it for me. It has been the greatest form of other business, generating revenue of other opportunities of meeting new people, of clients, of other opportunities. And it all has come down to, um, Hey, I've been listening to you for one episode or a year. Um, it's you? Yep. And before I can, even honestly, before I can ever even be like, okay, here's what I have to offer here is the program I'm running or here's my availability, you know, how can I help? It's like, I just, I, I resonate with what you, what you do and how you say it. And, uh, you're, you know, one step ahead of me or a hundred steps ahead of me. But then again, there's that mirroring of, it's not, I I'm trying to be you.

Chase: 01:01:58 And this is honestly how I've always chosen my mentors and coaches. It's just like, yo, I don't know. I mean, you're really not saying anything wild and crazy. We're not rewriting the book here. It's just how you deliver it. It's how you carry yourself. It's how I can relate to you. It's the vibe that I can get. And that's always been the determining factor in someone be like, chase. Like, what else do you have to offer? How can I work with you? Um, how can I just be involved? Like, what else do you do? Uh, and it's always just been you. Yep. You know, that's my, that's my experience with you. Absolutely. I mean, the way that you deliver content, the joy that you bring, the humor, uh, I mean, how much more humor could we all probably use in the world right now?

Jason: 01:02:37 A lot, man, it's, it's so true. You, you nailed it, man. This is something that we teach. We call it your Hoff and Hoff style, your hangout factor, the hangout factor is huge. So somebody looks at you and go, I don't know what it is about you, that I feel this way about you. And like, I watch you on, this is about this guy, man. I just really want to hang out with him. Like, he's just really cool. He's just a real dude. And it's like, it doesn't, it doesn't necessarily mean you're also sharing great content. But the thing is, that's why we say it's the 90 10. When I say it's 90%, you 10% of your content. Some people will think, Oh, it's a hundred percent mean, well, no, it's not a hundred percent. You it's 90 10. And the reason that the, the metaphor I give for this is if you're doing a heart transplant, right. The time that it takes to stitch somebody up after you've had put in a new heart, guaranteed, it's not more than 10% of the total amount of time of the surgery. Okay. Still a very important part of the surgery to stitch somebody up after that. Yeah.

Chase: 01:03:24 I got a new heart, but uh, it's wide open.

Jason: 01:03:27 Yeah. Yeah. It doesn't work. So, so you still have to be really good at what you do. You still want to master your craft. You want to hone in on how you can really serve people in a deep way, but know that that's not your differentiator because everybody else can go to the same certification school or they could go to the same college or they could have similar background and in work or in school or military or whatever else. But when you layer yourself into that, that's the real differentiator, man. When you show up as chase with your irreverence and the jokes with Nella and having may not respond to you when you're saying all these funny things, like that's what makes you, you, and then somebody that the key here is that, especially with the internet and especially with service providers on the internet, there are so many people who immediately, and I had this experience as a white rapper. [inaudible] you should freestyle. I'll be in the car. So it's a no for me, dog. It's a hard, no hard pass

Chase: 01:04:22 Chappelle run the whole, the whole time

Jason: 01:04:24 Or this one over here. Uh, so anyways, so, um,

Chase: 01:04:29 Spaghetti, I totally, I totally lost it.

Jason: 01:04:32 So, so, so hip hop audiences are one of the most judgmental audiences in the world. And I don't know if it would just cause I was a white kid, but I was a white kid in the nineties up on stage. Like I was a proper rapper, like doing shows all across. I opened for Bhutan in the past, like, like all up and down the Southwest Southeast, especially we were doing stuff. Uh, I'll be down the coast there. I did it for years

Chase: 01:04:53 And cleaning nothing to with they there and

Jason: 01:04:55 Cash rules, everything around me. Couldn't get the money. [inaudible] somebody should write that down. Somebody should write that down. Shimmy, shimmy y'all. So, uh, so the thing I remember from being on stage was I would be the white rapper doing my thing. And I was, I was pretty dope if I do say so myself, but whatever. And there would, you would see majority of the men in the audience, but the majority of, of dudes in the audience would have their arms crossed. And it's this guy I could, I could do better than that. And so me being up there, I felt all this resistance and it didn't matter how good of a rapper I was. Didn't matter how good my content was. It wasn't getting through those crossed arms. And so I said, okay, I remember thinking to myself consciously, like, how do I, how do I get them to like me man?

Jason: 01:05:31 Like, how do I get, how do I break through that? And I'm like, I'll make them laugh. And so in between songs, when I was on stage, I would do like some self-deprecating humor, jokes about stuff. And all of a sudden you slowly see the arms start to kind of go, ah, cool. Yeah. I mean, I'm still better than that, but like, and the same thing happens when you bring your hangout factor in the world is there's so many people who are resistant, Oh, another guru, another 30 something telling me how to live my life. And they're going to wag my finger at another 20 year old life coach or their 20 year old life coach. Right. And, and when, and when instead you should have seen them. Of course I get it. And instead, when you show up from this place of like, I'm not wagging my finger at you, in fact, I'm confessing about how this has shown up in my life and how I've totally Fs up and how I'm still working on it, then the arms get uncrossed.

Jason: 01:06:17 And they're like, okay, well let me just, I mean, they're probably BS, but let me just see what they have to say. And that's a beautiful thing about the internet is when you really show up authentically, not as a strategy, right? Because my, I have a definition of authenticity for me, authenticity is what's leftover. When I stopped trying to manage your impression of me, authenticity is what's left over. When I stopped trying to manage your impression of me, great definition. And that's what's left behind. Right? So the more I can be authentic, which is not something I try to do, but it's just what comes out when I stop trying, uh, then the more people's resistance is lowered. And then if I have a message to share with them, they're much more likely to actually hear the message.

Chase: 01:06:52 I think everybody has a really good meter. Uh, no matter the filter video, audio, Instagram, YouTube, no matter what, um, maybe I'm speaking out of place. I don't know, but I just feel like you can just tell, like, I want to follow this person. I want to read their book. I want to work with them. I want to work for them. Uh, I want to just allow them more in my life in one way, shape or another, uh, pay attention to that. People like it's, that's intuition, that's instinct. That's whatever. That's the mirror neurons like it's worth looking into it's worth making space for like, we can talking about this whole time. I agree. Nella, Mel, Nell's making a lot of space for, uh, for sleep. Um, she's been killing the space game. Um,

Jason: 01:07:35 You have an aura ring, Sheila, is she measuring your sleep? How's your sleep? She's giving me side-eye right now. Just so you know, this is like a very like Kardashian and you throw in shade at me right now. What did I quote you? And not like, give me credit what it was going on right now. Her resting heart rate is two negative four. It's pretty amazing. Yeah. I'm actually

Chase: 01:07:52 Right. She stayed up here the whole time. She not usually do that. No, she'll come and go. Yeah. In a lot of ways, she's kind of like a cat. She's like, I'm ready for attention. I'm done. Now I'm done. Then she'll just go back to bed. So sweet man. I'm so happy. She's with her mid shot. Talk about bringing joy to your life, to dogs, pets past it.

Jason: 01:08:10 I need to get another dog before I had an excuse that I was traveling too much. Yeah. And I said, this year, I didn't to travel as much. So it was your fault. Everybody said, they said you manifest the COVID. I'm like, this is my first. So in the three years I've lived in LA. This is my first summer here. Usually I'm in Europe for basically the entire summer different work stuff. And so this is my first time being here in summer and I was getting kind of stir crazy. And I've thought about like, maybe I need to get an animal. Maybe I need to have an animal that gets me like I it's of like, can I foster Nella for like a week and just see if it would, may like kill you. I would totally run a Bella. Oh my God. Now what can I rent you? And take you home with me? She's pretty dope. I've going to last. You went to sleep.

Chase: 01:08:46 Um, well, Jason, it's been so good having a show, man. We'll, we'll kind of wrap up here. The, you know, the book, prison break, vanquish, the victim, own your obstacles and lead your life. Um, I brought my pen. You brought the book, I got the signed copy. We're going to add this to the library. Can't wait to dive into it, man. Um, all the, all the things I've been talking about, everything I'm doing here today, it's just a culmination of my experiences. And we've been talking a lot about my story and my father, those two words came from him, ever Ford, ever Ford radio, my tattoo. Um, it's just, it's my whole way of being. And it started because it was a way like we're talking earlier. It was my tether to him. Uh, it was this thing that he just said his entire life.

Chase: 01:09:26 And then we got w we had to witness him finally live it, you know, he was like, no matter what, like happens for a reason, the obstacles, the way you have to keep moving forward. And literally until his dying breath, that was what it was. And so then when I embodied that instead of running from it, for, to me, like 10, 12 years to finally to have my body, to have my physiology, to have my emotions, my spirit, everything finally like rein me in and be like, you know, chase me to work on this stuff. Um, it became my entire essence for being, and so a lot of different things go into that fitness, nutrition, mindset, just self optimization, finding things and people like you, men who, who we can mirror from mirror with, and then get put on our path to live a life ever forward. And what does that mean to you? How do you live a life ever forward?

Jason: 01:10:14 Yeah, man, I love everything you said, by the way you're such, you're such a model for what you speak. Like you're your true self leader and you walk your talk. And I think everybody who listens to this and listens to your show and watches, you knows that that's the truth, the BS meter, a thousand percent, they know you're taking a about this. I love that. Yeah. And I love, I love this, this whole notion of ever forward to this whole concept that I've ever forward. And, uh, and to me it really does mean that I'm, I'm showing up every day and I'm, I'm, I'm really, I'm playing the JFT game. The Jesper today game tomorrow is none of my business, but today I can be super intentional about what I do and I'm going to have backslides. And I'm going to have times where I beat myself up and I'm going to have times where I fall off track and I lose sense of my purpose.

Jason: 01:10:59 And I start worrying if I'm on the right track anymore. And the more I know that that's a part of the journey, right? If I was born and they gave me a piece of paper and said, here are the dates where you going to question your purpose. And that date happened that I questioned my purpose. I'd say, okay, well, a part of my journey, it was already there beforehand. So if I can start treating my life that way, that all the, everything is temporary from broken bones to ice cream cones, everything is temporary, right? So the more I can practice that on a daily basis, then I feel like I'm living the life.

Chase: 01:11:27 You hadn't made ice cream cones, man, me too. I'm so hungry. My biggest takeaway is living a life ever for it means more ice cream,

Jason: 01:11:32 Definitely a thousand percent does I hope salt and straw will we'll sponsor the show going forward.

Chase: 01:11:38 Oh, it's been a good thing or a bad thing. But at the fact that I can walk to salt and straw, you can walk through here from here. Oh yeah, they're right down the corner. Oh, you should have told me that. I, in my mind, I justified, but like, Oh, the walking calories negate the ice cream, Kelly's absolutely right

Jason: 01:11:52 For the forecasts. Absolutely. A thousand percent, thousand percent.

Chase: 01:11:56 Well, Jason I'm of course have all of your stuff listed down there showing us where people, but where can they go right now to connect with you the most?

Jason: 01:12:01 I give you a link to give people a free copy of the book. So they get a free digital three 99 free 99, digital copy, audio copy. And if you're in the States, you pay a couple bucks shipping handling and to ship. So we'll do that. And then you can find me on Instagram and Facebook, I'm at Jason Goldberg because Jason Goldberg was taken. So I had to get the pretentious, Val, Jason Goldberg, you know, what are you going to do? Uh, and I post a lot of terrible cat memes and I posted a lot of content there. That's directly in line with the conversation here. So yeah, we can continue the,

Chase: 01:12:29 Yeah. If you guys have found value in today's message and conversation, the conversation with Jason, uh, like just go to his page and Instagram, it's just video, video, infographic. It's all of these things for yourself for, you know, all my coaches out there. Um, you know, I always hold a soft spot and you know, the coaching world because I do different versions of it nowadays. Um, but I just know how transformational it is for people, how transformational it was and still is for my life in terms of coaching being coached. Um, it's just having that person who is just at least one step ahead of you in any way, um, that you can, that you can jive with and you can mirror with, uh, it's transformational it's necessary too. So check out Jason Goldberg, the book is prison break and, uh, we're going to have a hookup in the show notes. You can get your own copy and don't sleep on this one. All right.

EFR 401: Ego Versus Legacy and Making Personal Development Fun with Jason Goldberg