"Valentine's Day isn't just about romance for me, it's about love in all its forms - friendship, family, self-love. The tradition of giving and receiving gifts, small gestures of kindness, makes it even more special."

May Yazdi Chewning

Valentine's Day often conjures images of heart-shaped candies and bouquets, but for my wife and I, it's a time to open up about the tapestry of our love story as well as the history of this day dedicated to romance. This episode journeys into the essence of relationships, starting with the Roman roots of Valentine's Day and how it evolved over time to celebrate love in its many forms. We go over the peculiar tradition of earmarking days for expressing love and delve into how early memories can tint our perceptions of such occasions. Happy Valentine's Day!

Follow May @mayyazdichew

Follow Chase @chase_chewning


In this episode, we discuss...

(09:16) The Evolution of a Relationship

(16:08) Origins and History of Valentine's Day

(28:19) Valentine's Day and Childhood Associations

(39:22) Is Love Lost in America?

(48:24) Love Languages and Relationship Evolution

(01:00:27) Moving Forward in Love and Relationships


Episode resources:

EFR 779: The Origin Story of Valentine's Day and How to Keep Love Alive Year After Year in Your Relationship with May Yazdi Chewning

Valentine's Day often conjures images of heart-shaped candies and bouquets, but for my wife and I, it's a time to open up about the tapestry of our love story as well as the history of this day dedicated to romance. This episode journeys into the essence of relationships, starting with the Roman roots of Valentine's Day and how it evolved over time to celebrate love in its many forms. We go over the peculiar tradition of earmarking days for expressing love and delve into how early memories can tint our perceptions of such occasions. Happy Valentine's Day!

Follow May @mayyazdichew

Follow Chase @chase_chewning


In this episode, we discuss...

(09:16) The Evolution of a Relationship

(16:08) Origins and History of Valentine's Day

(28:19) Valentine's Day and Childhood Associations

(39:22) Is Love Lost in America?

(48:24) Love Languages and Relationship Evolution

(01:00:27) Moving Forward in Love and Relationships


Episode resources:


00:00 - Speaker 1 The following is an Operation Podcast production. Hey everybody, welcome to EverFord Radio. I am your host and I'm joined by my wife. Hey, baby, hello. Today we're doing a special Valentine's Day episode. We're gonna be letting you all in a little bit to our love story as well as the history of Valentine's Day. Which one is right? Which one is wrong? Which one is it? Why are we here celebrating love today?

00:24 - Speaker 2 We talked about our early days and our relationship and how I knew I was falling in love, and we talked about five love languages and how those can develop over time and how to communicate what you need from your partner so that you can feel truly loved and connected with them.

00:42 - Speaker 1 Welcome to the show. I want you to age like a pro. I want you to join me in fighting age related decline with mydopure powered nutrition today. Sponsor, it is time to give yourselves new life with high performance products powered by mydopure, their powerful ingredient that unlocks a precise dose of the rare urolithin A molecule and promotes healthy aging. Why I love this product is because not only has my baseline daily energy increased significantly since starting mydopure over a year and a half ago, but because of the clinical evidence they have coming to the table 15 years plus of research, 11 human clinical trials completed in ongoing clinical trials involving over 900 participants. Quite simply, the answer to aging isn't a secret, it's science. Just two capsules daily for me to boost my energy, strength, endurance and maximize recovery time from the gym. If you want to learn more about time line nutrition and their amazing mitochondrial revitalizer product, mydopure, check the show notes today under episode resources or head to timelinenutritioncom.

01:51 Slash ever forward. In any product you want to try with mydopure, you can save 10% with code ever forward to check out. This is your number one source for inspiring content from people who are putting a purpose to their passion and truly living a life ever forward. I'm your host, chase Tuning. This is Ever Forward Radio. Friends, family, loved ones, ever forward radio listeners near and far. We are in for a treat today. Now, if you're new to the show, first and foremost, welcome. Thank you so much for being here today. You can be listening to literally one of millions of other podcasts out there, but somehow, some way, you are here because you want to learn how to move forward in life Physical, mental resilience, wellness, relationships, all the ways, I say, in which you can learn to live a life ever forward. And today is Valentine's Day, 2024. And if you're an OG listener, you're going to recognize my guest because she's my wife and hello.

03:05 - Speaker 2 Real, recognized real.

03:06 - Speaker 1 Real, recognized real I haven't been on. It has been.

03:10 - Speaker 2 VFR in a long time.

03:12 - Speaker 1 Over a year now, I think.

03:15 - Speaker 2 It feels longer than that.

03:16 - Speaker 1 May, and I May is my wife. She and I used to do a once a month episode on the show for a few years.

03:25 We sure did, and it was all about relationships, relationship, health, our relationship, relationship with yourself, coworkers, just the aspect of relationships and how they play a huge role into your total well-being, and I thought it would be fun to have her back on today. We're going to talk about LERB. We're going to talk about love languages, we're going to talk about like versus love. We're also going to peel back a little layer on our relationship. We give you guys a little backstory and kind of just say, hey, why are these two people talking about Valentine's and love and all this stuff? What authority do they have? Which I say, absolutely none, but we're going to do it anyway, as well as a little Valentine's Day history, like why are we celebrating this day? Why are we giving Valentine's and candy and cards and what's going on? What's all the hearsay?

04:18 - Speaker 2 I'm trying very hard to remember that this is your podcast.

04:22 - Speaker 1 Somebody need you to rein it in. Yeah, I know, respect.

04:25 - Speaker 2 I'm trying really hard not to cut you off and not to be my usual unhinged self, Because at EFR I know that this is a house of learned doctors and your listeners are also houses of learned doctors. Could? Be, and so this is a professional space and I don't want to ruin that Taint, that reputation for you.

04:51 - Speaker 1 Well, I appreciate that, but one thing about me. And there she goes.

04:58 - Speaker 2 I'm never going to stop being me.

05:00 - Speaker 1 May is a little unhinged still, because when we are recording a podcast together now, it is for our other show called Chase and May. If you want to check it out, I'll link it for you in the show notes. We put it out weekly, every Sunday, and it is absolutely nothing like ever for Dirty O.

05:19 - Speaker 2 It's a fun time.

05:20 - Speaker 1 It's fun, may and I just sit down. We get raw, we get real, we talk about current events, we talk about our life.

05:26 - Speaker 2 Yesterday we talked about music for like two hours yeah the most this episode for this week.

05:31 - Speaker 1 We had a concept in mind, but once we hit record, we literally just talked about music and our love for it and like connecting the dots to musicians and experiences, and I'll leave it at this. We created all over Nickelback. We created all over Nickelback. Mic drop.

05:51 - Speaker 2 No. So I used to come on this show, as Jay said, and I would keep it professional for the most part because I am who I am, but I would keep it professional, I would keep it light and fun. And then we decided we were like you know what, why don't we just make our own show where we can talk about whatever we want?

06:11 - Speaker 1 Bust out of this EF container.

06:12 - Speaker 2 And we can just be who we are and show our personalities and have fun with it. And really we just did it because Chase and I are we are super communicative. We probably talk too much to each other and they think and sometimes I'm like shut up, yeah, no. I definitely talk a lot and so we were like, let's just make this show, it'll be fun, and who cares what comes of it? So if you have any interest in seeing us or hearing us be absolutely me, absolutely unhinged, tune into that show.

06:46 - Speaker 1 But we're here. We're now first for the episode. All right, we're going to jump in here. Ok, let's jump in. I would like to give the audience a little background on us, briefly again, if you're new or maybe you haven't heard May on here in a while. Like I said, why are we talking about love?

07:02 - Speaker 2 So it all started in 1985.

07:03 - Speaker 1 In the year of our Lord, 1985. No so May and I have been together now, dating as a couple whatever, for almost 11 years, which is wild Right, but we are married, we are married. We have been married seven years now.

07:21 - Speaker 2 Oh OK.

07:23 - Speaker 1 Coming up this September will be a Keep losing count. Hello, do you know my name? Do you remember who you married to at least?

07:28 - Speaker 2 No, but last year, remember last year we thought it was eight years of marriage.

07:33 - Speaker 1 And then we just did the most basic math ever and realized no, it's eight or seven. Wow.

07:37 - Speaker 2 OK, so this year is finally going to be eight. Ok, got it.

07:40 - Speaker 1 So that's us. May and I met in undergrad. I was graduating from VCU and she was wrapping up her last year at VCU back in Virginia in the nursing program I was studying exercise science.

07:55 - Speaker 2 I have a question.

07:56 - Speaker 1 Go for it.

07:58 - Speaker 2 When people ask you the story of how we met, do you say we met in school.

08:05 - Speaker 1 I mean it just, yeah, it all kind of falls in that container.

08:08 - Speaker 2 OK, just wondering. Or I could say you know, because we technically didn't meet in school at all, like we didn't meet in a class, like we weren't in school together.

08:18 - Speaker 1 We met during undergrad.

08:20 - Speaker 2 OK, I'm just wondering.

08:21 - Speaker 1 Yeah, all right. Yeah, we met through my brother.

08:25 - Speaker 2 Right.

08:26 - Speaker 1 Who lives a block off campus. Ok, you want to get technical here?

08:30 - Speaker 2 I was just wondering. I was just wondering. Ok, all right.

08:33 - Speaker 1 So that's us, and the last thing I want to say about our background. I have a surprise question for May here, before we dive into the history of Valentine's Day. Ok, when did you know you were in love with me? Was there a moment, a day? Was it a thing that?

08:53 - Speaker 2 I said, oh, when did I know I was in love with you? Ok, in my head I registered that question as when did you know? I was the one, and every time people ask me I'm like I have no idea.

09:03 - Speaker 1 Oh, it's, interesting OK.

09:04 - Speaker 2 Or like how did you know?

09:06 - Speaker 1 Let's just go. When did you feel, when did you fall in love with me? When did you know? Yep, this is love.

09:16 - Speaker 2 To be honest with you, I don't think there was like a distinct moment. I'm very in tune with myself and other people in my life that I click with on a very deep level, Like if I could meet someone in an instant, I can tell what kind of relationship I'm going to have with someone, and so I feel like with you, probably like the day we met, to some extent I probably was already starting to fall in love with you. Do you know what I mean?

09:59 - Speaker 1 I do.

10:00 - Speaker 2 And I don't know that there was a distinct moment that I was like, oh, today I love him. I think it just happened very naturally and it progressed every day. I do remember one particular moment. There's a lot of the beginning of a relationship I don't remember, but I do remember one particular moment that stood out to me compared to other people that I had dated, where, because you were older than me and at that time being 21 versus you being 27 is a bigger age gap than it is now and you had more life experience than me just being in the military and everything as well.

10:46 So I remember there was a distinct moment where I was in my bedroom and I was with my two best friends at the time and I felt very not in control of the relationship, which was very new to me. Up until that moment, I was always in control of a relationship, with the exception of the first relationship I was ever in in my life, who was my first love. So after that kind of experience, I always made sure to put myself in a position where the ball was in my court, because I never wanted to feel out of control again and I never wanted to feel like I was pining over somebody who didn't want me and we got to a point early on in our relationship, within the first maybe month or two, where I was like I am completely not in control here and that scared me. That really scared me, because I was like, uh-uh, I don't like this. I like the feeling of control, I like the feeling of past guys pining over me and really childish kind of whatever. But I was 21.

11:56 Young love, young coming of age feelings yeah, and just trying to navigate the world of how do you have a healthy, balance relationship? I didn't quite understand that and you were that. You were very healthy, you were very balanced, I think because you had more experience than I did, you were older than I did, you were not into the games of it all and I was very much loved a game, loved a cat and mouse. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

12:23 And so I remember that distinct conversation being in my bedroom and telling my two best friends like I feel really out of control and like the ball's not in my core and I don't think that this is going to work.

12:34 And I remember both of them being like literally, get it together.

12:38 Like they were, like you're going to be OK if you're not in control for a second, you know, and don't do something stupid.

12:45 And I remember having this like internal conversation with myself of acceptance and leaning into it because I really trusted you. Like I really trusted you and I knew that you were just a good person, even if I didn't know that maybe we were going to end up together. I knew that you were a good person and that's all that really mattered to me because I was like he's never going to do anything to maliciously hurt me or cause me to lose my trust. And so in that moment where I had to decide like, do I keep moving forward, even though I feel really uncomfortable and I feel scared? That's what made me kind of say, okay, well, I guess all the balls in his court then and I'll just hang out and not be in control for once. So my point is I think that may have been one of the first moments now looking back, where, like I don't know that I was in love at that point but I was definitely falling, otherwise I wouldn't have done that.

13:51 - Speaker 1 Right, that makes sense.

13:52 - Speaker 2 If I hadn't, if I hadn't any other situation where I didn't feel in control, I would have been like I'm out, this isn't worth it. You know what I mean? I'm just going to keep moving on. But there was something where I was like I don't want to keep moving on and I feel really uncomfortable, but like I'd rather be in this discomfort than not be with him.

14:10 - Speaker 1 Thank you, yeah, thank you for sharing that. All right. So I'd be willing to bet a lot of you have heard about, or probably even consuming, omega three supplements. You know the healthy fats, which is amazing. But, like a lot of things in the nutrition and supplementation world, as time passes we gain more information and we have new things that can meet the same needs, but in a better way. Or like today's sponsor, fatty 15, we can significantly reduce our consumption of these products and boil it down into one simple pill a day and get even more amazing benefits, with three times more cellular benefits than Omega threes, fatty 15 is a sturdy nutrient that reduces oxidative damage and acts like an armor for your cells, keeping them young and healthy.

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16:08 So now I want to kind of get into the history of Valentine's Day, because a question I have around this, or a topic that I want to have you discuss, because I know you're very passionate about it, and it's this whole concept of why do we need a day to talk about love, to get flowers or cards or do a lovey-dovey act, you know, why do we need you to be my Valentine, you know, and May has some words she would like to share on that. And before we do, why are we here? Why are we even celebrating this? What is the holiday of Valentine's Day? And now I will link this all down the show notes, but the resources that I have found, I'm going to pull from, I'll say some credible resources, but honestly, who really knows?

16:58 - Speaker 2 Right, and that's what I mean. Well, resources called wiki.

17:01 - Speaker 1 No, I'm pulling from the New York Times, I'm pulling from history channel, historycom and NPR.

17:09 - Speaker 2 Good enough for me.

17:09 - Speaker 1 Okay, and I believe that those people, those platforms, would do their research to some capacity, all right, so if you disagree, go blame them. I'm trying to say Okay. So Valentine's Day and I actually found this across the board quite a bit, which makes sense. A lot of our holidays now trace back to ancient Roman times. Certain things that we do in civilization practices, rituals, but holidays. They call it.

17:38 A could have been a Roman Bacchanal and I'm probably butchering this pronunciation but B, a, c, c, h, a, n, a, l, bacchanal, bacchanal, um, but channel, but channel. I know my Latin is a little rusty right now. I'm a booby debopity, I don't know. But uh, and this one kind of surprised me because, well, it surprised me that this could be why we have Valentine's Day. But if you know anything about Roman history, man, those people got wild. So it doesn't really surprise me that this went down. And I actually found this a lot in researching Valentine's Day, and this is a direct quote from this article in the New York Times. The most common explanation for how Valentine's Day came to be is the ancient festival of Lupacalia, or Lupacalia, a raucous wine fueled fertility right in which Roman men and women paired off. I believe that's a very politically correct way of saying. They just had probably massive orges?

18:42 - Speaker 2 Yeah, probably knowing the Romans, yeah.

18:44 - Speaker 1 Raucous wine fueled fertility. Right, I'm dead.

18:48 - Speaker 2 Where men and women paired off. You're so right. You're so right.

18:51 - Speaker 1 Let's really read between the lines here.

18:52 - Speaker 2 Okay, it was a sexist, it was a sex party.

18:54 - Speaker 1 Yes, they were getting jiggy with it. Okay, you know, it was probably just one massive orgy in the Coliseum, who knows?

18:59 - Speaker 2 Okay, all right.

19:01 - Speaker 1 That was not a direct quote from the New York Times, that's definitely just me adding it in, but this theory has appeared in news articles for decades. Lupacalia was celebrated for centuries in the middle of February. Here we are, middle of February and eventually, as the Roman Empire became less pagan and more Christian, was transformed into a celebration honoring Saint Valentine.

19:25 - Speaker 2 Oh, okay, I was going to say where's the Saint Valentine at all?

19:28 - Speaker 1 So it seems to be that for many a moon, for now thousands of years, during this time of mid February, there has been some sort of celebration experience day of love, intimacy, partying, old school, pagan, human stuff, right.

19:54 And then, when they quite literally had their come to Jesus moment and Christianity became the new official religion of the Roman Empire, the Holy Roman Empire, they I guess anytime any, was supposed to say this the best way, one of the ways throughout history that governments, governing bodies, have been able to maintain control of their people, is to just kind of do like a swap. So if they were to completely take away this holiday, this day of celebration that had been going on for centuries, they would have had riots and people would have fought back. You know, which is pretty common in Roman history when they try to do too much. So like, hey, we're just going to swap it out, we're still going to have this day, we're still going to men and women pair off for fertility rights, kind of thing, but we're going to just say it's all under the umbrella now and honoring this Saint Valentine. Okay, now who is Saint Valentine moving?

21:00 - Speaker 2 on to another question another origin here.

21:04 - Speaker 1 I thought you said another orgy here.

21:06 - Speaker 2 Ooh, leave it to the Romans.

21:09 - Speaker 1 You know they put orgy in origin. Another origin Got it.

21:12 So Saint Valentine is another big reason I mean, it's literally why we have the name Valentine's Day come from Saint Valentine way back in the, I think, 1300s, no, even before that. I'm confused my resources excuse me but basically there's some speculation as to who exactly Saint Valentine was. But what we do know is there there are accords of two men being not crucified, but they were basically martyred. They were killed, you know, for being Christians. They were speaking the word of Christianity, valentine.

21:56 It's unclear as to really which one was which, but so I think, in that confusion and like a lot of things in the Holy Roman Empire and Christianity, they would just, they would make anybody that was killed, they would turn them into a martyr, basically, and so they declared one of the guys yeah, sure, this guy will do as Valentine. No one, which one was which Saint. They made him a Saint and so in honor of him in this I think it was like a burning at the stake or something was on February 14th, mid-february as well. So the day that they martyred Saint Valentine, one of these two dudes, was February 14th.

22:37 - Speaker 2 So sorry, his name was Valentine.

22:39 - Speaker 1 Yeah, something, something Valentine Like. It was probably like Valentino's Maximus.

22:45 - Speaker 2 You know, named him Saint. What do you mean? To make them a martyr. What does that mean?

22:50 - Speaker 1 So like when like to be martyred is when you are, like in, a very outspoken activist and people try to shut you up and then in they kill you for it. But the person is so steadfast in their beliefs that they're like dying for that. Right Purpose.

23:08 - Speaker 2 Right.

23:08 - Speaker 1 And there's usually a following for them and there's, you know, a lot of like. Usually it's also marks like a big turn in history, because when that happens, there's like a revolution or something uprising or something, because that was, that was enough of a thing to happen for the other people that follow that same cause that that person died for, to speak out or to write or to whatever which I think a lot of people know, that one, they're always Saint Valentine.

23:36 - Speaker 2 Yeah, I know I had something to do with Saint Valentine.

23:39 - Speaker 1 Yeah, but even still there's speculation around who exactly he was.

23:43 - Speaker 2 Yeah.

23:44 - Speaker 1 And they're like yeah, both of these guys, we think we're doing a lot of good for the Christian word. We think and yeah, yeah, yeah, let's just make a martyrs and we'll make them a saint.

23:53 - Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, yeah, cool Cool.

23:55 - Speaker 1 Yeah, and so that was another popular one, but there's another one that actually I never heard. And all of these things kind of happen around the same time. So it seems like for thousands of years now, many a moon mid February, has been a shift. There's been a shift in environment and weather and culture, which makes sense, you know, when you think back way back then around that time is probably when the first thaw was happening. No, we're getting out of winter a little bit. The weather is breaking, or at least it's stopping being hard winter Like stops snowing and craziness. You know, life is kind of coming back a little bit to the planet, excuse me. And there's this one, one source that I found, that kind of piggybacks off of the Luper Kalia story, how this is from history channel.

24:52 Luper Kalia survived the initial rise of Christianity but was then outlawed. It was deemed un-Christian at the end of the fifth century when Pope Galatius declared February 14th St Valentine's Day. It was not until much later, however, that the day became definitively associated with love. During the Middle Ages it was commonly believed in France and England that February 14th was the beginning of birds mating season, which added to the idea that the middle of Valentine's Day should be a day for romance. Again, this is the time. You know birds, they fly south for the winter.

25:30 This is when mother nature, animals, plants are kind of just coming back to life again, and apparently this is when birds first start getting it back on the English poet Jeffrey Shawseh. Shawseh was the first to record St Valentine's Day as a day of romantic celebration in his 1375 poem Parliament of Fowls Fowls being birds Writing quote for this was sent on St Valentine's Day. When every foul cometh there to choose his mate, valentine greetings were popular as far back as the Middle Ages, though written Valentine's didn't begin to appear until after 1400s. The oldest known Valentine still in existence today was a poem written in 1415 by Charles, duke of Orleans, to his wife while he was imprisoned in the Tower of London Following his capture at the Battle of Agancourt. The greeting is now part of the manuscript collection of the British Library in London.

26:40 England. Several years later is believed that King Henry V hired a writer named John Lidgate to compose a Valentine note to Catherine of Valleos. I'm gonna stitch all together here to wrap this up. It seems like, as, as humans evolved, there was a time in mid-February when there was celebration around love with humans and nature, yada, yada, yada, and it also just seems to kind of be Kind of a unique overlap of time when we began to record history.

27:15 Mm-hmm and so I think they were just kind of realizing this and so like, oh, like this is a very notable thing happening and we would write it down and we would share it and you know we actually had a chord of it.

27:25 So I, I believe it's probably one of those things who really knows exactly? But we're just gonna stitch two or three things together that are pretty strong and we're just gonna keep it going, All right. So that brings me. That brings me to a Lot of people seem to not really like to celebrate Valentine's Day. Mm-hmm, and it's so commercialized and you know it's just so people, Florists and cards and candy companies can just profit. But what's your take on that is love to commercialize right now. Do we need Valentine's Day?

27:54 - Speaker 2 Yes.

27:55 - Speaker 1 Well, you know what? Take a second, think about it, nope.

28:01 - Speaker 2 Some of you might not know me very well. One thing about me is it really grinds my gears when people yuck other people's yums.

28:16 - Speaker 1 Well, that sounds like what they were doing back at the Roman party.

28:19 - Speaker 2 What's the point of setting New Year's intentions? You don't need a single day to set intentions. What's the point of celebrating love for one day? You should love your partner every day. Yeah, of course you know that would. That would be like saying what's the point of your birthday? You're alive every day.

28:37 - Speaker 1 I have not thought about that.

28:38 - Speaker 2 You know, it's just so Silly. It's just literally so silly. I I love Valentine's Day. I love Valentine's Day. It's actually one of my favorite holidays, like why do you love it so much? I think I have a lot of really positive Associations with it, none of them having to do with men that I have dated. So I want to make that very clear. You know, obviously with you, but I had right, I've had positive associations with Valentine's Day.

29:08 - Speaker 1 Which, if you did, I was old enough to even date right. Which, even if you did, it wouldn't matter to me. No, it would matter.

29:13 - Speaker 2 I'm just saying that because I don't. I don't want people to think like oh, maybe she was showered with, you know, gifts and gold on, but no I literally never was.

29:22 But I'll tell you why. I have a positive association as a little kid growing up in America. You go to school and every year for Valentine's Day they would do those like you would decorate a little pouch, okay, and you decorate your pouch of Valentine's Day and then everybody would put their pouches on their desk and then on Valentine's Day, all you before Valentine's Day, your mom would take you to Target or wherever and you would pick out what Valentine's you wanted to give to all of your classmates and then you would sit there and you would write to Sarah from May you know how hugs or like kisses XO, xo, xo and then on Valentine's Day everyone will go around.

30:02 They put their little Valentine and everybody's little pouch and there was usually like cookies and cupcakes and it was just such a sweet, it's so sweet, it's just so sweet and I genuinely remember doing that. I guess I don't know if everyone does that in school. I thought that was like a universal thing that everyone does.

30:21 - Speaker 1 I definitely did it when I was in like elementary school, I feel like. To some degree they do that right and I don't know if it's still a thing right now, probably not because you're like, not allowed to take peanut butter to school anymore. Yeah, little Johnny is allergic to air.

30:35 - Speaker 2 Yeah, but like I had such good associations and I remember, even like growing up I would wake up in the morning for Valentine's Day and my parents would like Get me stuff for Valentine's Day because I was like a kid, you know. So like I was there Valentine and I remember I Don't know why, I remember this one found, and nothing crazy, by the way, but like as a kid, it's just exciting. I remember one Valentine's Day I woke up and my mom had bought nice cereal bowls that had, like mine, had two cans Sam on it, remember she can't see him.

31:09 - Speaker 1 Yeah, from Fruit Loops, the Fruit Loops.

31:11 - Speaker 2 Mine had two cans Sam on it and it was like a big cereal bowl but it had a handle on it so you could like drink your milk afterwards Wow, that's clutch. And she got us that and like inside of it were those Madeline's which I know as an adult love Madeline's. That's probably why I remember I just particularly remembered that as like one of my Valentine's gifts, and so I just have really fond memories like I I never had like a traumatic situation on Valentine's Day, like it's just, it's so sweet, it's red, it's pink, it's chocolates, it's flowers, it's like what's not to like, you know? So I feel like that's why I love Valentine's Day. I have good associations with it. I would assume if you're someone who doesn't have good associations with it, then you're maybe one of those people that's like yeah, what a dumb holiday.

31:57 - Speaker 1 Well, think about it. I think, like a lot of things in life that we have excuse me have positive associations to it comes from our childhood.

32:05 Exactly, exactly, yeah, you have a very positive recollection of this from your childhood and I would Imagine I don't want to assume that maybe people who feel that way Don't have that. That's what I'm saying and most likely you feel slighted. Maybe you know your parents didn't let you participate in Valentine's Day, or you didn't get a Valentine, or your school stopped it, or you couldn't give out, and so I mean that's imprinted on you, right, and you know. I would challenge the person who questions all that now. When did you first start thinking that way?

32:38 - Speaker 2 Yeah.

32:39 - Speaker 1 It's probably not you being a just normal adult. You're just a Scorned adult from a poor childhood memory.

32:46 - Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, no, totally that. That's literally why I love Valentine's Day. I just have really good associations with it and, like I said, it's just, it's like the holidays, it's like what's not to like. You know, every, like I said, you go into Trader Joe's. There's like all the new candies and all the new chocolates and it's pretty like, maybe because I'm a girl too, I'm attracted to reds and pinks and flowers. You know what I mean.

33:09 - Speaker 1 So yeah, it's a very it's a feminine holiday. It's a feminine day. I mean energy.

33:14 - Speaker 2 Yeah, there's a lot of like Valentine's Movies that I remember going to see at the theater when I was like in high school with my friends. I Pretty much never had a boyfriend until I met Chase and if I did, I can't recall ever anything ever happening. I do remember one actually got me a rose once and I was like I was like uh, wasn't much of a romantic back then, but I would always spend Valentine's Day with my girlfriends, always like From when I was a teenager and could drive, we would always do like gallantines, we'd go to dinner, we'd have pajama parties at our home, so it was just always like a fun girly thing. So I just love it and I feel like I feel this way about all the holidays that people complain about, like, oh, why do we have to have a specific day? You don't, but it's just like it's one day where that is your focus for the day. That doesn't mean that all 364 rest of the days of the year you're spiteful.

34:16 It just means you're taking one day out of the year to be extra loving and just really like intentional, with your love and your relationship and the P, and it doesn't just have to be romantic. Like I always text my girlfriends on Valentine's day, I text my mom like you know, um, and I just think what's wrong with celebrating?

34:39 - Speaker 1 Right.

34:40 - Speaker 2 I love celebrating.

34:41 - Speaker 1 There's nothing wrong with that.

34:42 - Speaker 2 I love celebrating If there is a. You know me. If there is a reason to celebrate, I'm celebrating. It's Tuesday and I just finished work Celebrate, you know I just I actually went to my exercise class. Celebrate, you know what's wrong with celebrating?

34:56 - Speaker 1 What did you celebrate in exercise class?

34:59 - Speaker 2 What did I celebrate? What? Did you celebrate and it's celebrate anything in my class. I'm saying like I would celebrate the fact that I went to my workout.

35:08 - Speaker 1 I got you Okay, yeah, okay Okay.

35:11 - Speaker 2 So that's my take on that.

35:13 - Speaker 1 Okay, well, thank you very much.

35:14 - Speaker 2 Don't be bitter, basically.

35:16 - Speaker 1 Yeah, we got you. This is a safe place If you need to unpack some childhood memories a little bit there. Um, there is one thing I would like to highlight that I really love and I love that they are back here partnering with Everford radio and that's Bub's naturals Collagen Collagen game strong. Now. You all have heard me talk about bubs and why I love them, but can I get your two cents?

35:46 May is a very tough customer. She's a tough cookie to crack when it comes to let me finish when it comes to any kind of supplement, she, I'll say, is pretty picky and she has to find things that work, first and foremost, but she's very particular about taste, about application. Is it a pill? Is it a capsule? How is this weaving into what I already have in place for my habits, my morning ritual, my drinks, my smoothies, my coffee, whatever? Can you give us a little shed, a little light as to why you love Bub's naturals grass, vet, hydrolyzed collagen, peptides so much and what it has done for your wellness since using them? We've been using them for years now.

36:32 - Speaker 2 Yeah, sure can, sure can. I started using bubs a couple of years ago. Number one, because I turned 30. Well, I was using it before I turned 30, but I knew that 30 was upon me, and I know that females lose 50% of their collagen stores by the time they turn 30 50% yeah that's a lot. That's the way that's half people.

36:55 Yeah, that's a lot and I was starting to get crickety knees and I just wanted to make sure that I was supporting, like my joints, and I was preventing signs of aging, like fine lines and wrinkles, and also just wanting to get more protein in my day because getting protein in for me and a lot of females is really difficult.

37:18 - Speaker 1 I'm always after me. I'm asking her what did you eat? How much protein did you get? Yep.

37:22 - Speaker 2 And so I started using bubs, just putting it in my morning coffee that I'm going to drink anyways, and I love bubs because it integrates into my coffee easily, like if you gave me one coffee without bubs and one with bubs, I couldn't tell you which one has it and which one doesn't.

37:39 - Speaker 1 I used to sneak it into her water. You did. I would mix it in your water and you never knew. Oh interesting. Bubbs is the only collagen I've ever tried that Agreed. It is detectless in anything, especially water Agreed.

37:53 - Speaker 2 You can't taste it and the consistency it just blends right in. So it's like why wouldn't you use it?

38:00 - Speaker 1 So, like May is saying, optimize your day one scoop at a time. Bubbs Naturals 20 ounce tub of collagen protein powder takes your morning coffee or tea or juice or smoothie or even water, like I said, to the next level. It's anti aging, great for your joint health and improves your hair, skin and nails. So if you want to check it out we are now back partnering with them you can head to bubs naturalscom. That's B? U B S N A T U R A L S dot com. Scoop up their tubs. Or they also have these little great travel packets. I keep a lot of my backpack when we're on the go, getting coffee in the airport or just. It's a great little way to get more protein in throughout the day as well, like may said and you can actually save 20% and they even hooked it up you can get an additional discount on your subscription. So if you're someone that already loves collagen and you're looking for one that we love and use and trust and recommend and when I take the switch, keep that regular supply coming in code ever forward at bubs naturalscom is going to hook you up and support the show. We greatly appreciate that Bubbs is helping us keep the lights on over here and keeping our hair, skin, nails, game, joint health strong. Thank you, bubs.

39:10 All right, now I want to shift into kind of the last section here, and that's just. Let's talk about love. I think you know love is in the air. Love is on top of mind for people right now. Here we are, valentine's Day 2024. May. What do you think is the current state of L? O V? E in America? Do people have it? Are they struggling to find it? Struggling to keep it? Is it just commercialized? Now? What's your take with love in America?

39:43 - Speaker 2 That's a really loaded question. What's my take with love in America? I think people for sure are seeking love. I think a lot of people's grief and loneliness and issues with, maybe, substance use and feeling detached and introverted and isolated comes from a place of really just wanting to connect with people, Like it comes from a sense of needing connection and needing love. I think a lot of people don't probably realize that, Like if you see, you know people who I work in in the mental health sphere, so I'm very familiar with this.

40:38 But you know, traditionally, let's say somebody is struggling with substance use, you know, and and to the outside world it's like, oh, like why, how did you get caught up in that, you know? And you did this to yourself and you're in all and oh, he's just a bad person, you know he's evil or hangs out with the wrong crowd, and it's like no, what they're looking for is a sense of connection and they're looking for love. Because if you talk to anyone who is a substance user when using things like fentanyl or heroin or morphine or drinking alcohol, it's all for this sense of, number one, numbing pain and number two, feeling a deep sense of love. That's what happens when you get, you know, quote unquote, high right. So I feel like that's what and that's, of course, is very extreme, but to varying degrees. I think a lot of people are struggling with that, that deep sense of connection.

41:43 - Speaker 1 What about in the general dating public, the world out there that is now on every dating app? Maybe they're going out still like back in our day it was, you know, you would meet people in school, at the gym and at the bar, at a restaurant, at a party. I feel like a lot of that has shifted over the years. I think a lot, you know, due to the pandemic. Maybe people struggle to still, you know, maybe get out or go feel safe in those kind of in-person experiences still, you know so many people's jobs now we've detached from other human connection. I mean I don't think always a workplace romance is the best, but you know you're not at work, you're not around as much people so you're just your only connection to others or really the real world is through a screen these days.

42:32 Yeah, and it's kind of maybe hard for you to answer this because you know a lot of our friends are coupled up now. We do have some single friends still. We have friends that are in committed relationships, that are married or, you know, date for long periods of time. So it might not be easy to kind of share a personal example, but if you had to just blanket statement, reply to those people that are. Maybe they don't know how much they really want love in their life. You know, maybe I'm not looking for it right now, but they're not doing things in their life to even just open up the chance, the possibility of two people meeting each other, that are meant to meet each other. How would you navigate that? What would you advise them to do, or what's your take on that?

43:23 - Speaker 2 Yeah, that's really hard. I always tell people, like you said not as much now, because a lot of our friends are coupled off and married off, but even up until a few years ago I feel like we had a lot of friends who would come to us as this like pillar of oh well, you guys have been together forever, comparatively to other people these days.

43:44 - Speaker 1 Yeah, in our experience being together more than like two years and most people's eyes was like whoa teach us your ways.

43:53 - Speaker 2 Yeah, and I would always tell them I was like you know what? I honestly have no answers for you, because it was a totally different world back then. And again, quote unquote back then it wasn't that long ago 11 years when May and I started dating.

44:10 - Speaker 1 I'm pretty sure was like the same year that Tinder came out. Yeah, and Tinder was the first one. Yeah.

44:17 - Speaker 2 But in Tinder, even Tinder was just like a hookup app. Pretty much, it wasn't even. Yeah, Um, it's hard. What I've heard from my friends is that I think what's happened, not that I don't think that the dating apps are bad. I think the dating apps are actually great.

44:33 - Speaker 1 Yeah, I agree.

44:34 - Speaker 2 Um, I think the difficult part is there was this sense before of Not settling in a bad way, but settling in the sense of like, okay, I found somebody who checks nine out of 10 things off of my list and we're compatible with each other and we have love for each other and we respect each other and we mesh in each other's lives easily and so sounds good. You know, let's move forward now, because there are so many options and you just see it in your face all the time. It has made it so much more difficult.

45:15 We've talked about this in other capacities, but this comes to mind here as well when everything is an option, or in this case when everyone is an option, no one is an option because you're always comparing and you're always thinking well, there will be someone, better, there will be someone better, there will be something better, and I hear this from some of my friends who are, you know, looking for their partners and oh yeah, he has nine out of 10 things, but he doesn't have this 10th thing.

45:43 And I want, I'm like nobody is perfect. Okay, he doesn't have that 10 thing. Then you'll go date someone else and they'll have that 10th thing, but they won't have one other thing, you know. And so, and I I'm very cautious to say, you know, oh, just this is good enough, like I, I want it. I don't want it to be perceived as like a settling thing, but also as more as like an acceptance thing, like oh, I like that, I like that.

46:14 You know it's like you don't. You don't have to think of it like you're settling on this person that has is 95% there, but maybe 5% isn't. And, by the way that, 5% that isn't there, good give them some room to grow.

46:27 No, but, like good, you shouldn't be 100% compatible with somebody. You should have things that you disagree on and beliefs that you may have different beliefs from one another. Yes, fundamentally you need to be on the same page when it comes to your beliefs in, like uh, religion and science and social justice, and maybe even to some extent, politics and things like that, and children and finances. But you know, if it's a difference of like, oh well, I don't know, I can't, I can't even think of something that's not as important, you know? Um good, you should have some differences. You know what I mean.

47:11 Like you, and I for example, it's like if I had to sit down and watch a TV show is probably going to be Bravo, it's going to be reality TV, whereas you want to watch something that's more action and military based, and I'm like I'll just be in the other room. This is obviously very trivial, but just using that as an example of like good, you know, you should have your differences, because that's how both of you grow together as well, and so I think when you did before the world of social media and the dating apps, it was a little bit of just accepting that, okay, this, this feels good, and I'm going to accept this and we're going to move on. We're going to get married. I say this all the time.

47:52 Do I think I met the one love of my life? I got so lucky that I met you on the streets of Richmond, virginia. No, like, if, if we allowed ourselves to go out there, I'm sure both of us would find multiple others that we could be in love with. You know, there's eight billion people in the world Like, let's be real about it. But I found you and I was like this feels great. Why would I want to look elsewhere, you know? So I think in that aspect. It's really tough right now. Not to mention, I think, the apps are so gamified to this swipe left, swipe right. What it does to your brain psychologically is dopamine Really messed up, yeah, and you're judging people immediately off of one thing.

48:43 You know, and we didn't have that. I mean, Instagram had just, facebook was out, but Instagram had just come out, but it was like we. I don't even think.

48:51 - Speaker 1 I knew it.

48:53 - Speaker 2 I don't have. You just saw people in person, which is different. It's like maybe somebody's not photogenic, or maybe they're being goofy in that photo or whatever it is, or maybe you can't sense their aura and their energy off of your phone. I just I can't imagine. Yeah, I'm with you Going to the gym. I can't imagine going through that right now.

49:13 - Speaker 1 So how do you think then love evolves in relationships. Let's say that we, you know, we found the person and it's new love right and that's going to grow and there are going to be a lot of natural evolutions that happen, I believe. I think you would as well in the first six months, a year, two years, but then after that do the same things work to keep love in relationships. How do you grow old love into new love? Or how should you say, how do you keep the old love that you have but still find excitement and maybe even develop new forms of love from old love?

49:56 - Speaker 2 I think it's all in. What it comes down to is just being on the same page with your person. It's like if you're both, like I said, fundamentally aligned and you're growing and you want to grow individually, then you will also grow together, you know, as a unit, and that's exciting. It's like I think it's so fun that you and I have gone through all of these stages of our lives together, where we met when we were really young and we didn't even have careers or jobs or responsibilities, all the way up to where we're at now, where we're 3000 miles away from where we started and we've created careers for ourselves in our own right and together, and we have our own individual paths. But we're also this unit, like people know us as chase and may you know, and To me it's, it's so fun. It's like, yes, it's fun in a different way. You know, we were younger, we were in absolute mess and we had no responsibilities and it was so much thriving.

51:08 We were thriving.

51:09 But in this way it's like you grow up and you go through these phases together, but we've always been on the same page when we're going through these phases, you know, and a lot of that comes back to being compatible and also communicating Not to say that we're always exactly in the same place.

51:28 You know, some years I will have a terrible year and she's having a great year, and then the next year things flip. But generally speaking, it's like we were on the same page about moving to California. We're on the same page about pushing forward in our careers. We're on the same page about when we want to move forward with having children and buying a home and stepping into that phase of our life, and I feel like that keeps it fun and exciting, because we know when we feel stagnant as a unit and we know when it's time to evolve into something, something else, and that, like evolution, I think, keeps everything alive, as opposed to just being in the same place doing the same thing. We're both also very motivated people too, so I think that that when one of us starts to lag in that area, the other one of us can kind of pull pull each other out of it.

52:22 - Speaker 1 I agree, I agree, and kind of on top of that, because I think when you meet somebody, your love languages can be pretty apparent, or that's something that I think a lot of couples maybe, as you're getting more serious will go through.

52:39 - Speaker 2 I know you and.

52:40 - Speaker 1 I did. We read the book the Five Love Languages, which I recommend for any couple but also just any human being. If you're single, divorced in a relationship, don't even think you ever want to be in another relationship. The way that that book helped me not only understand communication and just energy, exchange needs and wants in our relationship. It also helped me tremendously in just navigating people and learning like, oh, I need to communicate with this person in this way.

53:09 - Speaker 2 How they communicate.

53:10 - Speaker 1 Yeah, especially even in like the workforce as a leader, a manager business owner. It has helped tremendously. I'll link that for you guys on the show notes. But they are words of affirmation, acts of service, receiving gifts, quality time and physical touch. Do love? Languages change over time?

53:32 - Speaker 2 Absolutely.

53:33 - Speaker 1 Why and like what? If we struggle with that Like, oh, you used to like I would get you gifts and that was enough on Valentine's Day, but now you just want to like. You seem like you don't care about my gifts and all you want to do is just, like you know, cuddle me on the couch or vice versa, kind of thing.

53:48 - Speaker 2 Communication. I was laughing when you were saying that, because I can't believe. Now, knowing how solid we are and how well we know each other, it makes me chuckle that there was a time where we had to read a book to understand how to love each other.

54:08 - Speaker 1 Like that's so cute, like we were so cute.

54:11 - Speaker 2 We were reading a book, trying to understand, Like that wouldn't even cross my mind. Now it's like I know what you need.

54:18 - Speaker 1 I know you know, okay, that's cool.

54:21 - Speaker 2 So my primary love language especially back then when we were reading the book it was gifts. I grew up in a home. I just told an entire story about how my mom bought me a toucan sample and that's the one thing I remember. So, like gifts and giving me things and again doesn't have to be anything crazy, like she gave me Madeleine cookies was my love language. As I have gotten older, gifts are still one of my love languages, but it's moved down in the list. I feel like now I'm more so. Acts of service and words of affirmation and part of that, I think, is because of how we evolve as humans, how you start to understand yourself better. Gifts to me when I was younger made sense because I didn't know myself well enough. I just knew that mom gives me gift. I feel good.

55:19 - Speaker 1 People that I love and say love me in order to show that they give me gifts, they give me things. That makes sense.

55:26 - Speaker 2 Yes, but then the older I got and the more work I did on myself and the more I understood myself, I realized that, oh, I'm actually somebody who needs a lot of validation.

55:38 I need to be told that I'm doing a good job and that I'm successful and that I'm smart and that I have something to share with the world. I'm also somebody who gives a lot and I, like many women, do a million things at the same time and I make sure to have a full time job and be a homekeeper and do all the things. And so as you grow up, I think naturally I became someone who realized oh, I need to be told that I'm doing a good job and I need somebody to help me do the dishes, because these are things that when you're younger, they don't present themselves. So I think it definitely evolves over time and to some extent, you get to know your partner better so you can tell that their love languages have shifted in priority. But I also think it's all in communication. Like last year, you and I had a conversation and I don't think I said my love language has changed, but we had a conversation where I was like I need you to take things off of my plate.

56:45 - Speaker 1 Right yeah.

56:46 - Speaker 2 I have too many things on my plate and I am burnt out and I'm mentally exhausted and I need you to step in and do laundry and cook dinner and do these things. And that was me communicating to you that, like this is what I need right now for me to feel like you're paying attention to me and that you love me, and therefore you don't want me to have a full plate. And I'm sure to some level you knew that, but I don't think you realized at that time how heavy that was weighing on me.

57:26 And then I communicated it and ever since then I just feel so much lighter. I have so much more room on my plate to like pour back into other things, like you or other relationships or myself, because now I have the mental bandwidth where I'm like, okay, he can do that, so I can sit here and read a chapter of my book. You know, and you wouldn't have known that, at least to the extent to which I needed that, unless I communicated it with you.

57:55 - Speaker 1 Sure, I think anyone with any level of awareness or common sense could go oh yeah, if I pick up a few more household chores or do some things that I see my partner doing more regularly, you know, just let me help you out, kind of thing, of course it's not going to hurt.

58:13 - Speaker 2 Sure.

58:13 - Speaker 1 But when you just think it's oh, I'll do it if I think about it kind of thing versus oh no. My partner very clearly communicated to me where they're at, how they're feeling with all of these things, and I didn't know how light or how heavy this was affecting them or not affecting them.

58:30 - Speaker 2 Yeah, and I think, as you get older too, it's like you cut the crap right, yeah you get to the point.

58:37 You're like, what do you need for me? You just, you tell me what you need for me and I will do it. It's. It's you kind of stop with the oh, but you should have known, you know. Or like, if I want a gift, I will tell Chase. I'm like, hey, by the way, I want a foot massager. Don't guess you don't have to try, and that's me. For someone else that it may be different. But I think you grow up and you get deeper into your relationship and you realize like we don't need to beat around the bush anymore, like you're my best friend is like I can tell you exactly what I need and I don't feel any shame about it, I don't feel judgment, and so you can be more direct. Of course, in the beginning of the relationship you want to have a healthy balance of that.

59:23 - Speaker 1 Directness can be scary for some people yeah yeah, it can run them off.

59:27 - Speaker 2 Yeah, it could be not appropriate at times, you know, but at our point in this point in the marriage and our relationship, it's like why are we guessing, Like let's just communicate? I'll just tell you why I'm upset, you know well, it's very adult of us, Well yeah, I mean it's about time we're in our 30s.

59:47 - Speaker 1 Well, baby, thank you so much for coming back on the show.

59:49 - Speaker 2 Yeah, thanks for having me.

59:50 - Speaker 1 This was fun I hope you all enjoyed this little Valentine's Day special. We got a history lesson on Valentine's Day. We got a history lesson on me and my life and my wife and how love kind of has grown in our relationship over the decade plus now.

01:00:08 - Speaker 2 I got one last thing to say.

01:00:09 - Speaker 1 Okay, here we go.

01:00:11 - Speaker 2 L is for the way you look at me. Oh is for the only one. Are you gonna get like into a licensing issue?

01:00:24 - Speaker 1 Maybe yes, let's just cut the cord there, sure, okay. Last question I ask all of my guests, ever Ford, maybe through the lens of love and Valentine's Day here today, what does that mean to you? How can we move ever forward in relationships, in our love life?

01:00:45 - Speaker 2 I would say ever forward from the lens of love For me means this is hard Accepting. No, I take that back. Ever forward for me through the lens of love means to this is gonna sound obvious, but like not give up in your pursuit of feeling understood or looking for connection or expressing your needs to whoever it is, whether it's your partner or your family or your friends because you deserve to be loved in the way that feels good for you, and not feeling shame about that, not feeling any sense of judgment about that or any sense that you're a burden because you need this in a specific way. So just pushing forward with that and knowing that everyone else is doing that for themselves too. So keep going.

01:01:57 - Speaker 1 There's no right or wrong answer. Thank you for that, yeah, and with that we'll say goodbye everybody.

01:02:02 - Speaker 2 Doodles.

01:02:05 - Speaker 1 For more information on everything you just heard, make sure to check this episode show notes or head to everforwardradiocom.